Who had greater ability: TONEY (circa Barkley fight) or CHAVEZ (circa Rosario fight)?

Dont ever put Hatton or Vince phillips in the same sentence with Chavez:nonoChavez is the best Jw ever bar none! Only pryor comes close but ill take Chavez. This might have been Armstrongs best wt but he never won a title hear,doing all his work at lt or welter. As for Young Peter jackson GTFOH with that sh*t ,dont act like you know so much cuz ive heard your other posts?Tell me who outpointed chavez early in his career? dq reversed maybe but no one ever beat him! To mention Chavez stoppage loss late in his career is absurd and unfair,if thats the case you can say that about most of the greats that fought too long. Your an obvious Chavez hater,you dont have to be a fan but give the man his due as an atg and one of the best of his era.

 

Chavez never faced a fighter like Jones Jr in his prime. Hard to use that comparison.

 

I would say that Pernell is at least as great as jones,and Chavez pulled out 4 maybe 5 rounds in that fight. Better than Toney did,If my memory is correct Toney was shut out. Dont even try and dis Chavez competetion,he might have fought lot of nobodys on the way up but after he won a title he fought and beat all the best contenders or other champs available.

 

Im not dissing Chavez, dont take it the wrong way. Pernell had a different style, anyway which had him closer to fighters. Toney couldnt even get close to Jones because of his insane speed, and both were beaten conclusively in my opinion. The weight issue was certainly something that contributed to Toneys lethargic state, regardless of whether it was Toney's lack of discipline that caused it, it was still a factor.

 

This is why i made the comparison. but you do have a point as far as comparisons. I just think this is an easy answer,Chavez would have beat Toney if they were the same weight.

 

Defense was something Chavez was not known for,but he was a very underrated defensive fighter he use to slide alot of punches that people thought he took.

 

They had different skill sets, its Chavez inner qualities that separate them IMO but I know you never wanted this sort of response so....

Both could fight inside, Toney using smooth defensive moves & counterpunching... Chavez using similar defensive moves (arguably not as smooth but very effective still) occassional counterpunching & offensive pressure punching to both body & head.
They can both hold their own outside but where at their best inside, Julio had a decent jab & a lightning right hand lead, Toney himself had a good right hand, I think Toney in general was a bit slower, Chavez shut you down quickly & never gave you breath, you at least got a breather vs Toney - even if he was kicking your ass - I think Chavez was a better finisher too, faster with his precise finishing blows.

All in all, Chavez probably.

 

I think Chavez would beat a 135 lb Toney.

What now ?

 

For me it's Chavez, although I like Toney a lot as a fighter.

At 130 and 135 Chavez was supreme; just a great, great fighter. His relentless pressure and steady body attack just was too much for anyone at those weights.

Toney as a super middle beat respectable competition in Barkley, Hembrick and Thornton, but none of these guys were really world class.

I do agree Toney has the better defensive ability, but JC in that department wasn't a slouch back then either and he combined that with a scintilating offense.

 

Toney had better boxing ability for sure, no doubt Chavez was a powerhouse and ferocious puncher but Toney's slick counterpunching made him superior regarding skill level.

 

Chavez was the better all-around fighter, and by a pretty good distance I think.

 

Ok i agree that Toney was slicker,but dont you think breaking a fighter down systimatically is kind of the same as having excellent boxing ability? Although Chavez punched hard he usually stopped opponents by breaking them down methodically which in my opinion also makes him a great boxer/puncher.