Who has the better SMW title resume... A Ward or S Collins?

Ok that seems fair, but I still don't see why Roy couldn't fight Reggie, then give Steve a shot?

I see what you mean about campaigning at 175 earlier, but I think Steve would have been happy to move up in weight. It would have been a good fight

Yeah it's a fair point

Chad is clearly talented, but lacks the killer instinct. I find him frustrating to watch. Some of Scully's posts earlier made for very interesting reading, did you see them?

I see what you're saying, but I'm not so sure I can agree that Frazier was a more credible fight. If Roy went to HBO and said we're making a fight with Steve Collins, I'm sure they'd have rather aired that then his fight with Frazier.

Thanks bailey, and great debate. Seems general zod like many posters on here can't come into these threads without getting too emotionally invested

Every fighter has their naysayers, I agree with you there. Whatever Floyd Mayweather does, someone will write an article to criticise him

Roy was his own man, with a lot of power, especially after his win over James Toney, I'm sure he was able to pick his opponents, I still think he should have given Steve a shot. They were both champs at 168, Steve had a fan friendly style and a good following in Ireland and the UK, the fight made good sense. Obviously Roy fought and beat better fighters than Steve Collins, but it still would have been a good fight to make.

I think you've missed the point, why does it have to be one or the other? Why not both?

 

I agree, I think the fight should have been made for sure, but at 168...

I just don't think it was all that viable for Roy in 99, there were much better possible fights, DM and Hopkins 2, unifying with Johnson ect..

In hindsight, Roy would probably have destroyed him anyway, as Collins wasn't physically able to come back, much less compete with prime Jones Jr.

 

How on earth would fighting a guy who had been retired for 2 years and who had never fought at your weight,have been a credible opponent for Roy?

Everyone Roy fought in the 2 years after the Frazier fight were top ranked LHW's.

All of these fights would have been more credible than Collins at that point.

 

DM and Hopkins 2 were never going to happen for whatever reasons. It's a shame, Jones-Collins seemed a natural fight to make. I just wonder if someone jumped into the ring after a Klischko fight in germany, and they didn't fight them, would they be afforded the same excuses?

Collins retired because the only fight he wanted was against Roy Jones and no-one else, there was plenty of scope for the fight to be made, the blame is on Jones and his team

 

Jones fought Trinidad,wheh he was washed up and was just fighting for the money.

That kinda **** would never have flew when he was in his prime.

You think a SMW who had been retired for 2 years would have been a more credible fight than the LHW's Jones fought?

Lets also remember that while Collins was a huge name in the UK and Ireland, he wasnt some p4p type fighter. He held the WBO title, which was considered a lesser title back then.

In America, he was known as the guy that McCallum and Johnson beat. He wasnt some huge name.

He certainly didnt have a name like Trinidad(and even that RJJ/Trinidad was a complete joke)

As for Ward, he got rocked in his 7th fight as a pro...big deal.

How on earth do you think Collins beats Ward in the middle rounds??

Collins couldnt do that to massively inferior fighters to Ward.

He beat Pyatt at 160,and that was Chris Pyatt.

Froch and Collins are very similiar fighters. Ward-Collins would go down like Ward-Froch

 

I understand that DM never got made or Hopkins 2 when it mattered, but they were certainly viewed as possible fights that HBO wanted. I don't think either DM or Jones truly wanted each other, I think Roy actually wanted Hopkins again, but only for the right deal (60-40)

I don't hold it against Jones one bit that he didn't fight Collins in 99, and just as you said DM was never gonna happen, I don't believe Collins physically was able at that time period anyway. I would have much rather seen the fight at SMW, a few years earlier, I really think it was kind of irrelevant at 175 at the time, there were 3 different belt holders that was more on his radar.

It may seem funny, but Collins was too nice when calling Roy out in the ring. Perhaps had he taken more a Tarver approach and pissed Roy off, maybe Roy would have fought him.

 

You are actually gonna compare shot to **** Roy without many options fighting Trinidad, to Prime Roy known as the best in the world, fighting Collins, who had no belt when there was an entire LHW class to unify?:huh

And I think it is bull**** anyway, you make excuses for Calzaghe not fighting Froch who called him out numerous times but wasn't rated well enough, then hammer Jones for not fighting Collins at a time when he wasn't rated at all, retired, and never fought at the weight? Typical bailey logic, twisted to the point of being backwards.

Keep in mind, this was a time also when Roy was being criticized heavy for weak opposition, taking the retired Collins instead of fighting the other champions in the weight would have been just more of that. And Roy beating Collins at the time would have just been another name that Roy fought too late.

 

Yeah I was trolling, so shoot me

Yeah I caught the tail end of his career. I remember him becoming a tv presentor for a game show not long after I started following the sport.

I dont remember his first fight with Benn but I do remember his second.

Good times them, Lewis, Bruno, Eubank, Benn and Hamed all flying the flag.

 

Fair enough, I always respect your opinion MR. Jones not fighting Collins isn't that big a deal, I don't really hold it against him much either, Roy did fight and beat better fighters. I always thought it would have been a fun fight, Collins had an iron chin, and he would have come to fight and try to win, Roy at this time was at his absolute best. As is with boxing, rarely do the fans get the fights we want :-(

I bet Roy wishes he would have fought Tarver a couple of years before he did, but everyone's a genius in hindsight

 

I respect your opinion as well KO. I would have loved to see it at SMW, I think it would have been a fun fight for sure..

If I could change the outcome of any fight in Tarver's career it would be having him beat Harding the first time, because that would have put him in the ring with a much better Roy Jones.:good It was a blessing in disguise for Tarver, who would have actually had moments against a prime Roy, but would not have won IMO. I think it would be a clear decision for Roy, maybe losing 3 or 4 rounds tops. A late stoppage may not be out of the question for Roy due to Tarver gassing and Roy working the body. Tarver always has that one shot chance against Roy though. But not likely he can load up a big power shot like he did against the fading version of Roy.

 

I think it helped that all our major stars were huge personalities and the one with the least hype around him was arguably Benn but he always produced great fights to make up for it.

Good times.

 

How on earth could a win over Collins back in 99 mean anything?:nut