Who have the GREATEST RESUME of the last 25 years?

How can Roy Jones Jnr and Hopkins with numerous defeats be on the list and Joe Calazaghe who beat both, and never got beat at same weight classes not appear on the list. He deserves his place right at the top of that list

 

Ducktali,

I agree, but you said Roy had ZERO chance.

I would have given Roy a 40% chance of beating THAT version of Lennox.

Look, Lennox himself MUST have had a few reservations, otherwise he'd have taken the fight. Nobody is talking about ducking, but Lennox thought in March that Roy would be easy, for a ridiculous amount of money. Sometime around Sept, he told Roy that he wasn't going to fight again, and he didn't. So he OBVIOUSLY wasn't as confident AFTER Vitali, as what he'd been before. There's no way Lennox would have turned down that payday, if he thought it was going to be EASY. Again, I'm not being ridiculous saying that it was a duck, or Lennox was scared, but he obviously had some reservations. You cannot say Roy would have had ZERO chance, when Lennox made noises in March, and then retired around 6 months later.

It wasn't a bad example, and I was just highlighting how movement can frustrate a good guy with good skills. Haye has always tried to copy Roy's style, but he could never pull it off, because he hasn't got the footwork or the reflexes. He fights with his left arm swinging low, and his right out in front of him.

I agree that Wlad respected his power, but he wanted to knock Haye out after all of the trash talking etc, and he couldn't. As the rounds went on, he got more frustrated. Haye's movement gave him all kinds of trouble. Roy was much faster than Haye, even at 34.

I'm certain that Lennox would have been troubled by Roy's movement, even if he tried to walk him down and he wasn't bothered about getting hit. It's not beyond the realms of possibility that Roy could have stayed away from danger, from that version of Lewis.

The ONLY real argument I have with you, is that you've been telling me that Roy had ZERO chance of beating Lennox, based on the fact that Tarver and Johnson knocked him out.

Yes, I think Wlad was cautious because he respected Haye's power.

But you make it sound so easy. Roy had still had amazing speed and reflexes before he came back to 175. Lennox couldn't have just walked though him like that, because Roy was so elusive. Forget Tarver, Johnson, and Lebedev etc, Roy was hard to catch regularly pre Ruiz. I personally think that the fight would have brought huge excitement, but the fight itself would have been very dull. Roy would have been on his toes, and he'd have been extremely cautious. I could honestly envisage the crowd booing etc. Once again, Lennox obviously didn't think it was going to be as EASY as what you're saying.

Roy did rely heavily on his speed and athleticism, but his skills get overlooked.

He didn't have text book skills and box behind a jab etc, but look at his combinations etc? People massively underate Roy's skills, and say "Oh he was just a good athlete that's all." That's nonsense! What do you class as skills? Nobody is telling me that a lightning 4 punch combination with double hooks to the body, and then an uppercut of each hand upstairs isn't skill. I agree that his skills went hand in hand with his speed, and that's why he's struggled as he's got older, but Roy had unbelievable skill.

Meldrick Taylor and SRL were unbelievably fast, but they didn't throw combo's like Roy. Go and watch Roy's knockout of Paz and watch it in slow motion. Before you say it, yes I know Paz wasn't an all time great etc, but he was still a pro boxer fighting at 168, and he was world rated. There's nobody that could have knocked a guy out like that.

Roy walked forward, hit him with a lead left uppercut (who the hell walks up and throws a LEAD uppercut?) 2 left hook, switches his feet, then throws a right hook, a right uppercut, then finishes him with a left hook. That's a 6 punch combo, with two uppercuts, of off each hand. So yes, his unbelievable speed allowed him to do it, but if that 6 punch combo wasn't skill, I don't what is?

http://youtu.be/Z_K-7mAg_ew

34.30 - Who else could have done that?

Lennox was a great boxer. Holy was past his absolute peak, but he was still a great fighter. Maybe Roy could have stayed out of harms way, but not thrown enough to win a decision? Who knows, but I'm sure Roy's speed would have caused Lennox a lot of problems.

I don't think Roy was much slower, but he didn't fight rapid fire combinations, because Ruiz was the biggest guy he'd ever fought, and he was a little cautious. I agree that Lennox could have caught him and knocked him out.

But once again, my only argument with you, is that you are saying Lennox would DEFINITELY have won, and Roy had ZERO chance, on the basis that Tarver and Johnson knocked Roy out.

That is a flawed theory.

Before you reply back to this post, please let me respond to your other one's first.

Thanks!

 

This has been covered by the others, so I won't spend too much time on it.

At the time, it wasn't classed as a great win like the one over Toney.

Yes, Hopkins did become a better more complete fighter. But it's not as though he was 10 x the fighter he was at 28 in 1993.

You also have to take into consideration that Roy hurt his hand half way through camp, and Coach Merk tried his best to get Roy to postpone the fight. But he was 24 and it was his big opportunity. His Dad had held him back, and he'd missed Toney, McCallum, Jackson, Gerald and Nunn etc at 160. So he didn't want to postpone the fight. So he went in there without having sparred, and he actually had a hairline fracture.

So Roy wasn't at his best either. He didn't peak in my opinion until he was 26 in 1995. I would say that was Roy at his absolute best.

In the build up to their horrible rematch in 2010, Bernard said the reason he wanted Roy, was to avenge his only real defeat.

That's how he described it. He said "Roy was the only person to beat me clean without any controversy". After Roy had beaten him in 93, he didn't lose again until 2005. That's 12 years, and the fights with Taylor were controversial. So what does that say?

Roy at 24, with an injured hand, beat him, and then he didn't lose for another 12 years. That speaks volumes to me.

 

Ducktali,

How could 50-50 be fair?

The fight would have been at 168 catchweight.

It was easy enough for Bernard to move up.

It would have been hard for Roy to move down after spending 5 years at 175.

Moving up is much easier than moving down.

Also, Roy had one eye on going up to heavyweight, and didn't want to be moving down in weight. He'd already spoken to Holyfield late 2001, regarding a potential fight.

He also had the win over Hopkins from 1993.

Who else had Hopkins beaten apart from Trinidad?

Roy was the man.

This is how simple it was:

Roy was not going to move down in weight, to fight a guy who he didn't like, and who he'd already beaten, for a 50-50 split.

Hopkins could have taken the 40% and he didn't.

Do you seriously think that if Hopkins had have held a win over Roy, that he'd have done 50-50? No chance!

The deal in 2010, was 60% to the winner by a stoppage.

Bernard was only interested in Roy after he became vulnerable. After he'd lost to Calzaghe and had been knocked out by Green in under 3 mins.

Bernard was solely responsible for the fight not taking place in 2002.

I think Roy would have looked pretty stupid moving the goal posts after he'd been yelling "60-40 I kick yo ass, 60-40 yo ass his toast."

I think Roy would have gone through with it, and I think he'd have beaten him again.