WHO IS GREB

And I question that principle in general or at least how far it is taken. I'm not a Duran guy either. Lack of losses and succeeding at higher weight classes matter as do stops in big fights. Compensating for being smaller also matters but how much it matters and how much it makes up for in other areas of the resume. But I feel someone being able to narrowly outpoint guys who are bigger(talking Duran) is weighed too highly at differences that are too small and it compensates for too much in their resume.

Part of why Grebs lack of HW feats matters is that in the early 20th century it was normal for LHWs or even MWs to achieve at HW even if they didn't win the belt. Grebs MW victim Mickey Walker is one. Tunney, Loughran, Gibbons and Miske are all guys with wins over Greb that had more success at HW. Tommy Burns was a dominant HW champ at Grebs size. Grebs had a campaign at HW with some decent wins like Brennan and Weinart but his SOS was quite a bit lower.


Langford and Tunney both got things the other lacks, Langfords got the longer CV. The thing with Tunney is when he retired he had a case to be the best HW and LHW ever especially H2H. Even if you disagree with that no one before or since has had a claim to such a status. No unavenged losses, never was stopped and his resume while not as extensive Greb and Langfords is pretty great. While Tunney didn't have Langfords power he actually had a higher KO rate though this can be accounted for by how much longer Langfords career was.

Another thing with Greb is the short average distance of his fights like 8 or 10 rounds for a big fight. Especially early in his career. This matters cause over half his wins were decisions. Including every single win over the guys listed above. I do not value the 10 round decision as much as 12 and 15 and I also hold this against that 40s era.

 

You have some very odd criteria. And by all means, they actually hurt Tunney more than Greb. If you don't value 10 and 8 round decisions all that much, then that takes away from Tunney's 2 wins over Dempsey, his 2 wins over Hauck, his 8 round win over Loughran, his 2 wins over Jimmy Delaney, and his last 2 fights against Greb which consist of the only singular clear cut win he has over him. That leaves him with a record of 2-1 against him, which is dubious in itself because his first win over Greb was by almost all accounts a highway robbery.

All that's left for Tunney are basically Greb's sloppy seconds in either very past their prime or entirely shot versions of Levinsky, Gibbons and Smith. Also Johnny Wilson and Georges Carpentier. Yippie, what a resume.

Greb's wins in 12 or 15 round matches on the other hand, include wins over: Mickey Walker, Johnny Wilson, Jeff Smith, Tommy Loughran, Tommy Gibbons, Bill Brennan, Gene Tunney, Battling Levinsky, Clay Turner, Chuck Wiggins, Leo Hauck, Soldier Bartfield, Bob Moha and Jack Dillon. It's an absurd comparison.

As for Tunney potentially being the best ever H2H at LHW and HW when retiring due to him beating just about everyone he fought, same could also apply to Greb. Nobody after 1916 managed to beat Greb while not losing one himself, the few who got away with it before that were mediocre fighters that were lucky to face a novice version of Greb. There is a reasonable case to be made that Greb is also the GOAT MW and LHW resume wise too, and a fair share of people do have him as such, and a lot of people have him as something close to that. Nobody who ever lived considered Tunney both the GOAT LHW and HW when ranking greatness, and nobody even considers the possibility of Tunney being the GOAT Heavyweight.

 

Hi Buddy.
Thank you, a tour de force of puncturing the others persons case, well thought out, and written in easy and understandable script, I for one cannot see a counter argument, much of what you say chimes with my own thought process, not that it matters.
stay safe Ioakeim, chat soon.

 

Grebonte "Tank" Davis was born in Javertsville, Texas, around the turn of the century. The big century. He was a veteran of two foreign wars and three others that he could recognize. When he was born, doctors told his parents there was a sixty percent chance he would live...but that there was only ten percent chance of that. He was fluent in Vendergood and several other languages he practically invented. Not least of which...was the language of love... for just one woman. His mother. Nancy Sidis Oxenfree-who reportedly died a virgin, but was wholly familiar with God's loophole, from the age of 15. Davis would fight to purchase his mother's prized horses, which was another thing that happened in his life. He is said to have bedded down nearly 12 women, but loved none. Kissed seven. When he was 27, he learned to yodel. As a fighter, he fought good, and he fought plenty.

But plenty of good was not what "The Rubbernecking Gambler of St. Lucian of the Apennines" was into, as he was called, nor what influenced either his life or his death. What he was known for was fighting. And fight he did. Fight to prove his father wrong about the wrong son dying, and fight to show his teachers that blondness was not the sole pathology of ambition. In 1947, he finally succumbed to Grunter's Disease. A disease which causes all of your feet to smell like plantain-and one of your thumbs. It is characteristically accompanied by mild headaches, biannually, and a kind of dull look in the nostrils. He didn't die. But that is when he succumbed to it and stopped fighting. The disease. He stopped fighting the disease. He continued to box, but became kind of a doomer about his disease, and was often heard wandering the streets at night shouting "My feet and a thumb will never cease to smell of plantain! Curse these headaches once in a while!" and the like. But he kept fighting as a professional boxer until the age of 78.

He currently resides in Florida and watches YT clips of America's Got Talent, pretty much all day. His son, Herb, collects plinths. His mother who died a virgin earlier in the story has since come back and also lives in Florida. She feeds herpetic monkeys in the park and tries to spot and paddle intersex children with a ruler. It's not a hobby. It's apparently a job with the state. She's remarked upon no plans to retire, unlike her
"lazy son." Who, incidentally, does work part-time still, giving monkeys herpes and leading camera crews from The History Channel into various swamps where people have sighted different weird things. He once beat "Iron" Mike DiBiase at curling. I'm sorry, I thought that was relevant but it was "Scrap Iron" Mike DiBiase whom he beat, who was not relevant.

 

How many threads on this forum right now about Billy Miske? Not about Dempsey or Greb or Tunney but Miske is mentioned like this thread, they're about Miske and Miske was the principle character from the OP. How many?

Okay, how many threads about Sam Lanford?


It isn't difficult to see how these names are propped or how a fan might be unsure of Greb. He fought very few of the names you guys actually talk about from the era. Dempsey even less, Tunney not at all.


I'm not here to tell y'all Billy Miske ain't ****. You can decide for yourselves, but there is an irony in these claims juxtaposed to the forum itself.


No one needs told in Marciano threads about Louis because Louis has his own threads. No one needs to learn about Ali from Holmes threads because Ali has his own threads. No one need read about Jack Johnson in a thread about Dempsey because JJ has his own threads.

Billy Miske

Bill Breenan


... Y'all want me to act like they're ATGs because you mention them in other dude's threads as ATGs? Seems like they're left out of the we talk about you based on your own merits gang. We talk about Miske and how great he was when defending Dempsey, Tunney, and Greb from the very obvious criticism of they did not fight the best. It's super obvious because youse lot never talk about it unless explicitly asked.


Can you name another era handled in this way? Where the men who actually have a wealth of threads about them and their greatness are placed in a secondary class while those who lost and/or ducked them are praised but only exclusively when praising the champions who reigned over them. Name me one more era like that.


Oh, so y'all 100% full of ****.

 

Literally every one.

Buddy Baer, Abe Simon, & Lou Nova are generally discussed only in the context of Louis beating them.

Lew Tendler, Richie Mitchell, Rocky Kansas, & Charlie White are discussed in the context of Benny Leonard beating them.

Lou Ambers, Ernie Roderick, & Petey Sarron are discussed in the context of Armstrong beating them.

LaStarza, Cockell, & Harry Matthews are discussed in the context of Marciano beating them.

Lou DelValle, Eric Harding, Reggie Johnson, & Clinton Woods are discussed in the context of RJJ beating them.

Unlike many other fighters whose legacies are intrinsically tied to another's, Miske at least has the standalone credential of being a HoF inductee.

 

Miske knocked out Bill Brennan while terminally ill. He should be talked about more.

 

That will certainly answer his questions in a summation as short as one could go while still doing him justice.

 

The first paragraph in that post is probably enough for that, actually. The rest is just filler.

 

Fair enough.

 

Do you also accept Harry Greb as our lord and saviour ?

 

That would be Greg Page.

 

Close enough.

 

You should read the other news reports!

According to a book i once read nearly every one of Greb's defeats were down to him being ill at the time