Who is more skilled at their best ?... TONEY or HOPKINS ?

LMAO...

First, maybe you should research who you are talking to about boxing knowledge bro. Whatever tho...Im not gonna get in a pissing contest with you over who has seen more fights (or fought more either). My point is, you said that Hopkins doesnt throw hardly any punches, but the simple fact is A PRIME HOPKINS THREW AN INSANE AMOUNT OF PUNCHES!!!

That alone exposed that you dont know as much as you think you know. It was later in his career that he morphed into a more stalking, thinking mans fighter...one that conserved his energy and fought in spurts. Again, do some research.

And your argument (better? When did spelling become important to truth in a discussion? Especially on an internet forum? :roll is based on how Hopkins would have performed if he wasnt dedicated like James? His dedication to the sport and learning the nuances of the sport are exactly what made him great. To take that away is to take away what he is.

That is like saying Harvard Law is gonna think the kid in school who got a C+ but didnt study is more intelligent then the one who did study and got an A+. That argument is ridiculous (again, better?).

The question wasnt who is the more natural athlete, that would be hands down James Toney. The question was "who was more skilled at their best". That is inarguably Bernard Hopkins.

Now go and research please..."BRO"!

(BTW, bro is an endearing term jackass...like buddy, friend, pal, man, etc.)

 

Slight edge to Hopkins. Toney had mad skills.

 

Hopkins was a great fighter, and only been down twice in his career. Toney has been down three times in his career, but then again he had over 20 pro fights more than Hopkins. Toney was KD'd only once in his fight with Roy Jones (get your facts straight), and we all saw that - it was more a push than a punch and because James was fooling around. James was off-balance and he wasn't hurt at all. But this is irrelevant as to the question of who was the more skilled fighter. Again, this is not about resume or legacy, but about skills alone.

1-Toneys footwork at his peak was on par with Hopkins.
2-In and out movement goes to Hopkins, yes
3-lateral movement goes to Hopkins too
4-Ring intellect - slight advantage to Hopkins
5&6-irrelevant as to who was the more SKILLED fighter. But at his peak Toney was very fit and dedicated, with great stamina (McCallum fights)
7-Toney. Toney at his best was one of the most accurate fighters ever.
8-Toney
9-Hopkins
10-draw
11-Toney
12-Toney
13-Toney
14-Hopkins
15-Toney

 

Just think of this analogy if it helps. Lets think of school kids since you used that. JT is the kid who never came to music class and had disregard for practicing his instrument. Bhop practiced and practiced and learned all he could and became a great musician. But, bhop always played what he would recite and always worked hard.

The Toney came in, sat down and played something that he didnt rehearse because he has the natural ability to do so. It was more spontaneous and more beautiful because he had the ability all along and wasnt reciting practice.

That is why JT is great. I got Milk Baby!

 

I disagree with just about everything you said (especially the footwork, accuracy and timing aspects)...but as always Frost, at least you can intelligently put it without resorting to insults. That alone allows me to respect your opinion more than others.

As for the KD vs Jones...my mistake...your 100% correct. :good

 

Toney is better to watch but Hopkins is more skilled, his logevity is sign of our well skilled he is.

 

Well I can see your clearly a huge fan of Hopkins I am as well the guys the second coming of Archie Moore IMO and I agree with most of your post there pretty solid I certainly think Toney was better at slipping and picking shots ..to be honest counterings about 50/50 Toney's looked better while doing it but Hopkins did it just as often if not more so. In the long run I agree with you Toney at times was too inconsistent like against Jirov who was kind of like a miny Arthur Abraham still styles make fights and I think it would be a total chess match if they fought eachother as I said before I don't honestly have a clue who would win if they faced eachother I would bet on a really close victory for Toney for the more effective shots but wouldn't at all be surprised if Hopkins won the battle with a brilliant gameplan or just being more active than Toney.

 

It depends which you count as more important. I think Toney had great natural skill, so i went for him, just barely. But Hopkins had great footwork and movement, plus was better at ring intelligent. Plus he did more with the skill he had.

 

Simply watch the Joe Lipsey fight from 1996....

 

in a perfect world where both Toney and B-Hop come-in at 100% i'd say Toney by a wide margin.

but

in reality a fighter with great talent (Hopkins) and dedication would beat a fighter with greater talent (Toney) who lacks dedication and disregards conditioning.

 

easily toney but that idiot turned to steriods. Just look at how out of shape and moving up to heavyweight and like 40 and still goes 12 rounds, not getting knocked out or badly hurt from those big guys. and hes only 5'10. This one isnt even close.

bernard is more crafty. hes a spoiler. likes to hold and gain any little advantage any way he can. Please, Toney is far more skilled.

 

I agree that James Toney is a better counterpuncher than Bernard Hopkins.If anybody should be compared to Archie, it is JT and not Hopkins.Archie and James Toney fought a similar style and they both fought regularly for years at heavyweight while starting out much lighter.
Hopkins is a great fighter himself but Toney has more of an old school style than Hopkins.

 

Toney wasn't always a fat tube of goo SMW and CW were his best weights when he got older he stopped giving a crap about the shape he comes in but in his prime he didn't lack dedication or conditioning.

 

Of course JT was inconsistent but we are talking JT at his best (the one tha fough McCAllum and Barlkley).

I see this as an even matchup with Toney landing the harder shots and Hopkins being more busy.

 

I can't vote, because this question doesn't have one answer in my mind.

Toney had more natural skill, and fought by using skill primarily.

Hopkins was possibly more effective and difficult to beat, he fought by utilizing a gameplan and relying on his proven learned tactics.

:bbb