Who is the best boxers of the 21st century other than floyd and pac

What point am I missing exactly? You’re basically saying that Ward is a better fighter than Pac because he was undefeated but that’s not how that works. Pac beat many champions who are far better fighters than the ones that Ward beat. Just because he took some losses doesn’t mean he isn’t a greater fighter than Ward.

If we’re going by that logic then that must mean that Rocky Marciano is a better fighter than Muhammad Ali because he “escaped unscathed”.

 

Ward is a better fighter than Pacquiao not because he is undefeated but because of how he was able to overcome the problems he faced from opponents. Ward was a better ring general than Pacquiao so was Floyd which is why Floyd outclassed him. Yes Pacquiao looked spectacular but you saw how he could never master JMM. You may not like my opinion but yes I stand by it 100%. Ward was better than Pacquiao.

 

So then you agree that Rocky Marciano is better than Ali? After all he did overcome the problems he faced with his opponents, as you said. He always found a way to win without ever being bested, unlike Ali.

I’m just going by your way of thinking. Yes I do agree that Ward was a better ring technician, that doesn’t mean he was a greater fighter overall.

 

You are totally missing my point. Marciano is not better than Ali or Sven Ottke better than Calzaghe or Calzaghe better SRR. Rocky’s opposition does not compare to Ali but Ward faced a really level of competition, Pacquiao faced a really high level as well but did not always prevail. Ward worked out Krusher Kovalev and prevailed. Pacquiao never figured out Marquez over 4 attempts therein lies the difference in ring IQ.

 

Not really, I think at this point you're just not making much sense.

You're saying Marciano isn't better because his opposition doesn't compare to Ali. So why doesn't the same logic apply with Pac and Ward? Ward's opposition does not compare to Pac's, nor does any of his wins for that matter. Therefore he isn't better.

 

I am saying they both fought a high level of opposition and sometimes Pacquiao was found wanting whereas Ward never was. Simply put 2 all time great fighters just Ward is better than Pacquiao. Now I know you might not like to read or hear that but I believe their relative performances, the eye test and the facts prove I am right. Of course you are entitled to your own opinion however wrong it is.

 

Ali got figured out by Frazier and Norton. Marciano never did. He also faced high level opposition as well. This is based on your logic.

And no it doesn't really prove anything at all that you are right. Yes you are entitled to your opinion and that's fine. But the difference here is that you are in the minority with your opinions on Ward being better than Pac. Ask any reasonable boxing historian / analyst and they will tell you that Pac has had a better career than Ward. I'm just speaking facts.

 

Great post & yeah i think you got it right with the Crack Smoking conclusion.

 

Flo you must be losing Brain Cells at this point with this Back & Fourth, have mercy.

 

Marciano never fought any heavyweights as good as Ali , Norton or Frazier who brought the best out of each other. Like I said everyone is entitled to their opinions however wrong. I am not interested in popularity contests. Being more popular hardly makes fighter A better than fighter B. Ward has superior ring generalship and IQ to Pacquiao. You seem fairly knowledgeable about boxing so I know deep down you know this as well even if you don’t want to acknowledge it.

 

Marciano did face Ezzard Charles, Archie Moore, Joe Louis, and Jersey Joe Walcott who are certified ATGs.

Everyone is entitled to their opinion for sure, the thing is that your opinion is indeed dead wrong. It's not a matter of popularity contest between Pac and Ward, it is an absolute FACT that Pac is greater. I acknowledge the fact that Ward is a better ring technician, that doesn't make him better in my book. Pac is greater because of his much better resume and doing things that is seen as almost impossible.

We'll just have to agree to disagree on the matter.

 

Who were all past their best. I am not even convinced that Marciano would have beat Floyd Patterson and certainly not Sonny Liston. I don’t know anyone who does but maybe that’s your opinion. Please let me know.

You at least finally admit Ward is the better ring technician than Pacquiao just in your book Pacquiao is better. Sorry Sir I am not buying your book! Yes let’s agree to disagree. We don’t need to fall out, just expressing our different opinions.

 

1 Manny Pacquaio
2 Floyd Mayweather
3 Oleksandr Usyk
4 Joe Calzaghe
5 Saul Alvarez
6 Wladimir Klitschko
7 Juan Manuel Marquez
8 Andre Ward
9 Bernard Hopkins
10 Vasily Lomachenko
11 Nonito Donaire
12 Vitali Klitschko
13 Tyson Fury
14 Gennady Golovkin
15 Sergey Kovalev
16 Miguel Cotto
17 Sergio Martinez
18 Erik Morales
19 Kostya Tszyu
20 Naoya Inoue
21 Roman Gonzalez
22 Terence Crawford
23 Marco Antonio Barrera
24 Carl Froch
25 Artur Beterbiev

 

And that's part of the reason why many people don't see Marciano as better than Ali. I don't think he gets by Patterson or Liston myself. Ali fought and beat better opponents but took some losses along the way.

I already pointed out that Ward was a better technical boxer a few posts earlier, many would agree on that. The point I was making is that better technical skills and undefeated record doesn't equate to being better than the other fighter just based on that alone, it comes down to resume and overall body of work.

I'm glad we can discuss our differences without being hostile, I don't mind a friendly debate.

 

Knocking out every single opponent you faced leaves no questions answered. Edwin Valero 27-0 27 kos>>>> any record in history.