Who is the Best???...Fitzsimmons or Greb?

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by dpw417, Dec 20, 2010.


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  1. dpw417

    dpw417 Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    A question for all the historians. What is the general consensus of the board?
     
    dpw417, Dec 20, 2010
    dpw417, Dec 20, 2010
    #1
  2. janitor

    janitor VIP Member Full Member

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    I would have to say Greb as things stand.

    I do think that the gap might narrow if the full significance of Fitzsimmons resume were ever understood.
     
    janitor, Dec 20, 2010
    janitor, Dec 20, 2010
    #2
  3. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    I'd like to add two questions for the board to consider.

    1) Which fighter started at the lower weight?

    2) Which fighter achieved more as a heavyweight?
     
    McGrain, Dec 20, 2010
    McGrain, Dec 20, 2010
    #3
  4. PowerPuncher

    PowerPuncher Loyal Member Full Member

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    I saw some newspapr articles during Grebs time who rated Fitz/KEtchell higher. Rose tinted glasses? Maybe, I think Greb was in a more competitive, more developed era
     
    PowerPuncher, Dec 20, 2010
    PowerPuncher, Dec 20, 2010
    #4
  5. El Bujia

    El Bujia Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    From what I understand they covered about the same weight difference throughout their careers.

    You'd have to go with the champion in this one.

    Overall, I'd agree with Janitor's take.
     
    El Bujia, Dec 20, 2010
    El Bujia, Dec 20, 2010
    #5
  6. bodhi

    bodhi Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Consensus of the board probably is Greb. And they have a good point. He had a lot more fights against top class opposition than we know of Fitzsimmons. Hoewever, Fitz´s resume and achievements are astonishing itself and we have to consider that his resume is incomplete and that he very well may had more than double the number of fights. IMO it´s a toss-up.
     
    bodhi, Dec 20, 2010
    bodhi, Dec 20, 2010
    #6
  7. Unforgiven

    Unforgiven VIP Member banned Full Member

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    Fitzsimmons.
     
    Unforgiven, Dec 20, 2010
    Unforgiven, Dec 20, 2010
    #7
  8. dpw417

    dpw417 Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    I'll let the historians haggle about the merits of the opponents ranging from Tunney, Sharkey, Norfolk, Jeffries, Walker, Nonpariel Dempsey, Brennan, Ruhlin etc...
    It's real guesswork trying to take into account how a fight between the two would go. I would imagine Greb's movement would give Fitzsimmons a load of trouble. In that short clip of Greb fooling around with Philadelphia Jack O'Brein, say what you want to about how Greb looks...Impressed? No?...I am. If one were to only look closely at the mock sparring, and not the record book, you can see the versatility, and the speed that made Greb such a handful. Greb also appeared very well versed at crowding and holding and pivoting around to find openings at different angles. O'Brein displayed some cute moves too with a small right hand dig to the stomach as Greb went out in a straight line...that brought a smile from each man. Greb demonstrates the ability to fight in close, and jab at distance setting up his attacks.
    I think Fitzsimmons would have had a fit in trying to line Greb up for one of his power shots. One could envision Greb being able to score, then move back out before Fitzsimmons can get off. Contemporaries say that Fitz had one of the most cunning boxing brains in being able to set traps, and had the mental strength to believe in himself (and his punch), weather the storms, and spring the trap, catching an opponent with a devastating punch and changing the coarse of a fight.
    What is so incredible about Fitzsimmons is how he was able to hurt men who were so much heavier than he was, with a single punch. Corbett dominated Fitz during heavyweight championship, but Fitzsimmons turned the entire fight completely around with only a single punch. That kind of power is remarkable...If Fitz catches Greb it must be considered that he could hurt Greb badly. But how that equates to hitting a much faster man however, also needs to be considered. It is not necessarily prudent to judge a fighter's ability to fight against larger men, than men the same size because of the difference in speed. This may be the story of this fight between two of boxing's immortals...Greb can definitely outspeed Fitz? Could Fitz eventually catch him?
     
    dpw417, Dec 21, 2010
    dpw417, Dec 21, 2010
    #8
  9. kmac

    kmac On permanent vacation Full Member

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    Greb, but I wish there was some fight footage of him. he has the better resume imo.
     
    kmac, Dec 21, 2010
    kmac, Dec 21, 2010
    #9
  10. klompton

    klompton Boxing Addict banned

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    When you get to the level of guys like Fitz, Greb, and Langford does it really matter who is better? Its kind of like trying to figure out if you would rather have sex with Megan Fox or Natalie Portman...
     
    klompton, Dec 21, 2010
    klompton, Dec 21, 2010
    #10
  11. kmac

    kmac On permanent vacation Full Member

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    :lol: well, langford is better than both of them in my book. he's like a prime raquel welch.

    This content is protected
     
    kmac, Dec 21, 2010
    kmac, Dec 21, 2010
    #11
  12. Flea Man

    Flea Man มวยสากล Full Member

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    I've done a fair bit of research on both. Both beat much bigger guys, both had their own incomprehensible style. I'd say Greb, there's just more depth and diversity. But with Nonpareil, Maher, Sharkey and Corbett, as well as having displayed his toughness and ability against some other serious hassles (Jeffries for instance) Fitz had it all as well.

    Greb was even more freakish from what I can gather. I can see the argument for Fitz, but I have him at no.12 on my alltime P4P list and Greb at no.1.

    But I'm a massive admirer of Fitz's body of work, if anyone wants to make the argument I wouldn't necessarily disagree, he was outstanding. By all accounts a master scientist for his day, he could come out and bomb but could be ultra-cagey too.

    From what I've read, the 2nd Maher fight just over the Texas-Mexico border was like Jackson-Graham x1000. Maher was knocked spark out for ten minutes, was 180lbs to Fitz's 160 (IIRC) Unbelievable stuff.
     
    Flea Man, Dec 22, 2010
    Flea Man, Dec 22, 2010
    #12
  13. turpinr

    turpinr Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    it has to be greb.
     
    turpinr, Dec 22, 2010
    turpinr, Dec 22, 2010
    #13
  14. MRBILL

    MRBILL Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    I'll choose Bob Fitz......:deal:bbb

    MR.BILL:hat
     
    MRBILL, Dec 22, 2010
    MRBILL, Dec 22, 2010
    #14
  15. turpinr

    turpinr Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    fitz must be more over-rated than dempsey, if thats possible
     
    turpinr, Dec 22, 2010
    turpinr, Dec 22, 2010
    #15
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