Who Is The Greater Fighter As Of Now?

Never done an ATG list, but I do consider Lennox Lewis to be greater than Bernard Hopkins taking all things into account.

It comes down to names for me. Who beat the better fighters. Who beat the more significant fighters, and who looked better doing it. Lewis has the better names on his record IMO. I rate them to the degree that I think despite Bernard Hopkins terrific feats at higher weight classes, Lewis still remains the greater fighter, based solely on the quality of his opposition. For me, at least, Lennox's Heavyweight reign>Hopkin's Middleweight reign, which is the decider for me. I respect Hopkins accomplishments outside of that, such as winning world titles at Light Heavyweight during his 40's, but I feel that the opposition he faced, compared to Lennox Lewis's, gives the edge to the big man.

For the record, I'd love to see a step by step resume dissection :good:yep

 

Lewis, beat every man he faced, happy to take on any fighter when in his prime.

Hopkins was dominated by a one handed Jones and was foruntate he had the sense to duck Joe Calzaghe in 2001.

The biggest thing of all is Hopkins is credited so much due to his logetivity, which is some massively to do with him being a drugs cheat.

 

First off, their Amateur credentials...sorry I couldn't help myself

But this is a tough tough question, and it's hard for me to put bias to one side here as Lewis is one of my favourite ever fighters, and I despise Hopkins mainly for his racist abuse to Calzaghe.

So, let's look at the facts. Lewis will go down as one of History's greatest ever Heavyweights. Lennox Lewis beat every single person he fought. Names like Bruno, Botha, Grant and Briggs were all blown away by Lewis, as were Golota, Morrison and Razor Ruddock. He also showed he could box when needed as he stayed away from the dangerous Tua and Mercer, while getting a wide UD against Tucker. Now, on top of that, throw in two wins (yes TWO WINS) against Evander Holyfield, as well as destroying the former 'badest man on the planet' in Tyson. In his last fight, at 38 (?) years of age, beat the guy who is currently number 2 in the division, busting him up pretty bad. When talking about resume, we also have to take into account losses. As we no, Lennox was knocked spark by McCall and Rahman (a pretty good HW). How did he respond to these? Well, he won every round against McCall before knocking him out, and then produced possibly the sexist 1-2 ever when he stopped Rahman in 4.

So, let's balance this up. Hopkins is an incredible Middleweight, one of the best ever, with very very good wins over the likes of Mercado, Glen Johnson, Joppy (had to include him as he beat Duran) and a stunning annihilation of Tito. He also had a good, if not great, win over Oscar (who was never a middleweight). But his middleweight run will be remembered for the Roy Jones fight, where Roy won a pretty clear decision over him. He would also lose a decision to Jermaine Taylor and, in the rematch, lost again, unable to 'do a lennox' so to speak. Of course he jumped up in weight and defeated the likes of Tarver, Pascal, Wright and Pavlik, but to me, his biggest fight (against Roy) he lost convincingly. His losses to Taylor do hurt him, but he has more than redeemed himself with his LHW resume. But then of course, comes an old Calzaghe, who gets the decision in a close fight (think I had Joe by 1), a defeat he never had the chance to redeem. These defeats hurt him in the overall standings (even if he is an ATG and a phenomenal boxer)

So for me, Lennox nicks this. He has a slighty better resume than the highly rated Hopkins, and beat every man put in front of him which is all a fighter can do. Hopkins tripped up against a great RJJ, as well as Taylor who really isn't THAT good. While he had very very good wins on his belt, Hopkins losses this debate for me.

 

Add a poll dude. :good

Lewis takes this for me, not a whole heap in it though.

For me the depth on Lewis' record is the deciding factor, being immensely dominant and being, I think, the best HW H2H that I've ever seen.

Hopkins gets kudos for longevity, being a clear current number 1 past his prime at LHW and a great run at Middleweight but Lewis nicks it for me.

Posting on my phone, but I'll expand later.

 

Personally, I take Lewis's losses to McCall and Rahman with a pinch of salt. Why? Mainly due to the fact that:

In the McCall fight, Lennox Lewis was not in his prime. Physically (as we discussed in the other thread ) and technically. Lewis was a much lighter, and therefore more fragile fighter at the time of the McCall fight. It's not until he teamed up with Manny Steward that he was correctly conditioned, and added some weight to his frame, making him more stable as a fighter. Lewis also had some glaring technical issues going into the bout, one of key reasons why he was beaten by McCall. Lewis from the off was a poorly balanced fighter, he held his legs far too wide apart, meaning he struggled to get the proper leverage on his shots. He also fought rather wild, with little defense including him having his chin up-in-the-air regularly. This allowed Oliver McCall to time him and land the right hand bomb which led to Lennox being stopped. It's not until Lewis teamed up with Steward that he ironed out these glaring technical errors, and I do believe that a Steward trained Lewis would beat McCall on their respective best days.

Against Rahman, Lewis went into the fight severley under-prepared. He had been pre-occupied with trivial matters (such as the filming of Oceans 11) in the build up to the fight, and because of this had not trained correctly and had not sufficiently adjusted himself to the demanding altitude of South Africa, where the fight was held. Lennox reportedly turned up in South Africa 2 weeks before the fight, not really ample time to align himself with the altitude, or get into proper shape for the bout. Lennox came in at a then career high weight of 253 pounds. Watching the fight, it's clear that Lewis is not in prime condition. He gasses after a few rounds, looking lethargic and weak throughout, right until Rahman lands the bomb that puts the exhausted Lewis to sleep. Like with the McCall fight, with the right preparation, Lewis disposes of Rahman with no problems at all (like he did in their rematch :hey)

Maybe you consider those to be excuses, IDK :conf (I wouldn't really blame you if you did). Maybe Lewis under-preparing, and not being able to get the job done unless fully motivated and 100% detracts from him as a fighter and his legacy, but to me it proves that on his best day, when he was 100% he could, and did, beat every opponent that he faced. I'm not saying I discount the losses he suffered, but I certainly take them for what I feel they truely were :good

 

Ooh, and when Bowe runs form you, you no your a mean arse mother****er :deal

 

There's very little between them.

I could write an essay about it but come to the same conclusion.....

Negatives - two bad KO losses either side of Lewis best years vs dominating a relatively weak era

Positives - dominating a strong HW era beating an assortment of styles vs being ultra-adaptable, capable of beating more talented (on paper) fighters

 

I think you summed it up nicely Flea. While Hopkins does have very good names on his resume, he ultimately ruled in a far weaker division whereas Lennox dominated a stacked division in a very good era.

Both ATGs obviously, but Lennox should be considered greater

 

Not even close IMO

Hopkins.

 

I'd say Lewis, but both would be comfortably in a top 50 with Holyfield close by.

I've never actually bothered to do a list, I might print a few off the classic and jig them around as to where I'd fit them.... though they'll contain some fighters that I've never really had chance to watch.

I tend to do lists per division or per decade, an all time list is virtually impossible for me, given how the sport has changed. To be honest I think with eight or even twelve weight classes this era would look very good, there'd almost be a doubling in depth obviously.