Who is the more accomplished heavyweight: Frazier or Liston?

Frazier Easily. Frazier did what Liston could never do in a hundred fights... Beat Ali

 

Honestly, it's hard to say who's the more accomplished fighter. Both men were great heavyweight champions with intriguing careers.

I'd have to give the edge to Frazier by virtue of the FOTC. To this very day this fight was the biggest event in boxing history and there will never be another build up to that one. If Liston had beat Ali in any one of their two matches, an argument could be made that Liston's career was more accomplished. Frazier getting blown out by Foreman doesn't help his accomplishments and there are a few other fighters, namely Lyle, Shavers, and Jimmy Young, who Frazier never faced.

 

I think on paper it is frazier easily! But Liston really gets sold short in looking at it. He was ducked by many boxers of the day, if not for Patterson going against managments wishes, it might look even thiner.

 

In terms of record I would say Frazier after your excellent summary. I think the first loss to Foreman is Frazier's only real blemish, but I still find it as lesser of an blemish than Liston's losses to Ali, because of how those fights ended. Also Liston doesn't have a win/performance that is nearly as good as Frazier's over Ali.

In terms of technique Liston was more accomplished. He wasn't as one handed as Frazier, but Frazier showed greater stamina and heart in my opinion. And his left hook might have been the best single punch in HW history.

 

Why does everyone say Joe was one handed? I know his power shot and favorite punch was the left hook, but he had a decent right jab (see the Quarry fights), he would also dig the right to the body time after time in most fights. Where did this sterotype come from?

 

The "one handed fighter" theory that applies to Frazier probably comes from people who have only seen the FOTC. Frazier threw a lot of left hooks that night and I dare say he wasn't at his best mentally.

Ali had Joe so mad and full of hate that night for all that happened throughout their relationship. Joe was loading up heavy with the left hook and looked like he was trying to knock Ali out with that one punch. Joe threw some right hands in the FOTC but the left hook was the primary focus.

Frazier actually had a better right hand than most give him credit for. He surprised Quarry and Bugner, and even landed a few solid right hands against Ali in the FOTC rematch. Who knows what would have happened had Frazier fought Foreman in the same shape he fought Ali in the FOTC and if he was able to find his right hand that night.

 

I rank Frazier above Liston in my list. He was in a competitive era, had better W's imo including a win over the GOAT.

id fancy Liston to beat him if they fought prime for prime though... :think

 

Might be a case where the one who is more accomplished loses head to head to the other.

 

I could undertake to make a case for either of them.

They both beat most of the top contenders around on their way to the top, cealed their number 1 status with an all time great win, then lost the title unexpectedly, albeit to a great fighter.

I consider them about equal on paper but tend to rank Liston one place higher as being the more versatile of the two.

 

Sonny had some big hands. :toney

 

Zora Folley was a leading contender when Liston beat him.
Some will disagree with me in saying Cleveland Williams was a contender too.

I dont think Jimmy Ellis was a contender when he fought Frazier the second time.

 

Where is # 8 Wayne Bethea, # 2 Zora Folley, Cleveland Williams, and nino valdez who was ranked # 2 coming into 1959? This is one of the most bias summaries I have ever read you post in favor of a certain fighter Chris.



You list the Roy Harris and Dejohn fights ahead of Folley, williams? LOL

 

if someone had never seen either fighter and just looked at the figures joe would win every time and probably rightfully so. both were great champs but frazier accomplished more. h2h however i think liston is the much better fighter