Who of the following would you favor to beat Usyk?

LMAO

Usyk isn't even a big heavyweight so i don't understand your point.

Btw Frazier pinned down ali who had foot speed roughly equivalent to Usyk is not possessing faater feet so again i don't get your point

 

This has been gone over many times but i think you have to take into account glove differences, training techniques, modern day training, modern day supplements, ring differences, weight differences,...etc... in assessing how an oldschool boxer would fight a new generation boxer.

If you look at older boxers they held their hands up differently within the glove and had less width on the glove to cover behind them. It was harder to defend from big shots and the gloves felt more unforgiving on the hands.

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The gloves are better shaped today and look a bit longer, more wider and have more padding in the front. It's easier to defend from shots with the modern glove than is was with the older gloves Norton and Ali wore here. There's just enough coverage in the modern glove to give that extra edge to the boxer defensively.

An elite boxer should be able to translate over to any era. I think pitting older gen boxers with new gen boxers have differences which may also hinder them rather than benefit them if it was possible to use a time machine to make these fights happen.

 

I can see where you're coming from when talking about guarding but isn't a smaller glove easier to slip?

 

It's easier to slip but i think there's also less coverage for the fighter to use the gloves to anticipate a punch coming (less room) and more of an open target. I think it would be easier to read a larger glove than a smaller one personally. I think it's easier to land punches on the gloves today than back in the older eras.

Boxers back then seemed to rely more on head movement than today's who often use the high guard as their main defense strategy.

I think there's positives and negatives with both gloves. I think more positives with the modern era gloves because of the advancements and more comfortable shape which would help overall punching technique.

Some of the more elite boxers today have a lot of old school skills whilst also adopting modern techniques and benefit from advancements of today's technology. Golovkin, Lomachenko, Canelo, Usyk, Fury....etc... all use old school techniques in their arsenal to benefit them.

With the modern day gloves i can hit the punchbag without wraps and i don't feel my knuckles will rip apart. My knuckles have toughened up but when i tried the oldschool gloves my hands felt like they were going to rip through the glove when i was just punching the bag for 5 minutes. The older professional gloves are like the equivalent of cheap everlast gloves you buy at a sports store.

 

What you don't understand ?
That Frazier is: 1.82m with 185cm. reach, and Usyk is 191, with 198 reach and will have easy time with Frazier?
He just lack physicality to posses a thread for Usyk. And again we reaching the moment with just because X or Y fighter beat Z or C fighter, doesn't mean a ***** in boxing, or in football, or in tennis, neither in any given sport.
Frazier beat Ali, but was that prime Ali for real? No it wasn't. And the main question that will answer the question for Usyk beating Frazier will be, can Usyk constantly move for 12 rounds and yeah he can do that with an ease.

 

He's barely smaller than Breidis and Breidis had him on the ropes in spots. As a matter of fact Frazier weighed more, and Frazier has delt with larger fighters than Usyk. Ali has quicker feet and he's the same size as Usyk yet he still got pinned down SEVERAL times and beat down.

Moving around is not how you beat Frazier because he is on you relentlessly

 

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Here just watch the Nistor fight. Nistor is practically the same height as Frazier and a total bum compared to Frazier but he was relentless and had Usyk on the ropes several times and Frazier would be working the body once he has Usyk backed up. Frazier was better at pressing forward than Nistor and moved his head while doing it too. He was also better in the pocket than Nistor

It is no coincidence that Usyk had issues with slow plodder Chisora early on and struggled and shelled up when Breidis pressed the action. Pressure makes Usyk uncomfortable and Usyk is particularly vulnerable to bodyshots. Joshua is not Frazier and Frazier is not Joshua.

 

Ali and Louis

 

You are starting to look obsess, maybe you should try visiting the doc?
How hard is it for you to understand and stop losing my and everyone time, that everyone got a view and opinion.
You can't make mind, is it that hard to get it?

And for how many millions time we need to go that, just because X or Y fighters perform in a certain way, doesn't mean a Z or C fighter, who posses similar style will perform in the exact certain way.

And once again you are using an absolutely prime version of Frazier, and the worst version of Usyk, that had bad camps/injury goings on or just had a bad night at the office.

And for god sake Briedis is 1.86 and has a reach of 1.90, not the same as 1.82(same say he was shorter like 180) and 185cm.
And when exactly was Usyk vulnerable to bodyshots? Oh yeah ***** dear, in his amateur days. Just another biased thing you are showing.

Should i start bringing stats and stuff from Frazier only loses ? You understand how dumb that is ? Or you have hard time seeing it ?

As fart as Nistor, same thing with giving X or Y fighters as a example not work in boxing. And Usyk outbox the head out of this guy, and was never in danger at all. The so call KD wasn't taken by the judges, cause it was LOW BLOW.
And yeah let's forget 15 minutes of a schooling, cause Usyk was on the rope for a total of 20 sec, fully on guard, and taking no damage at all.
Usyk knows how to cover and not take damage when he is "pinned".

And how on the blue hell you are going to prove that past prime Ali have better/faster footwork than Usyk, as well as better cardio ?
Ali started to rely a lot more on clinches, since the year we are speaking, and the reason was obvious.

As far as Chisora goes, again this was Usyk at 10% at best, and Chisora is a lot bigger than Frazier. And you can bet your .... that he is a lot stronger too. Also looking by the logic, todays athletes are WAY WAY WAY WAY, let me write it 1 more time, WAY stronger than the one 40+ years ago.
You can use your brain and you will understand why.

The only thing i agree is that Frazier will looks, exactly like that:

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But let have more laugh, at how good "hard" Frazier was to hit.

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Don't make me laugh.
Usyk is the same height/reach as Foreman, and he looked like a giant infront of Frazier. And Foreman was 99kg. in the first fight with Frazier.

 

I wouldn't have thought about larger gloves being easier to read unless I was actually in the ring myself. interesting.

 

All of them have a shot. Really. They are all great fighters. Usyk went life and death with Chisora and then handily beat AJ. That is not an indication that he'd clean house. 2 fights? Really?

 

None of above...You have to be Kidding...

 

I really don't understand this kind of comments. It's like one guy said it and others just repeating without actually watching/scoring a fight.

How many clean shots did Chisora land on Usyk ? If less than 3, how was it "life and death" ?

 

You clearly do not understand my posts. Briedis's size advantage over Frazier is tiny and Frazier is better on the front foot. Frazier will not try and use his height and reach. He will steamroll right into Usyk all night. Get him on the ropes and pound away. Briedis had success when he pressed forward. Had that been Frazier he would not have given Usyk any room to breathe unlike Briedis and Frazier has better head movement than both Chisora and Briedis.

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For reference^^^^

Had that been Frazier Usyk wouldn't have had a second to breathe. He would not have stalked Usyk like Briedis did, looking for openings, he would have been absolutely relentless all night and made it a dogfight.

So todays athletes are WAY WAY WAY WAY, let me write it 1 more time, WAY stronger ? Is that why Holyfield claimed ancient Foreman was stronger than Lennox Lewis and Riddick Bowe. Both of whom were top 90s SHWs ? And both of whom were strong enough to manhandle Holyfield ? Regardless strength isn't going to be much of a factor. Usyk didn't use his strength to his advantage at cruiserweight, desoite the fact that he was bigger than most, and he never displayed any notable feats of strength. It was his boxint ability that was amazing.

Foreman manhandled Frazier while moving around him to keep him at bay, pushed him around, and reset Frazier to prevent him from getting into range while timint that unorthodox head movement. Usyk does not fight like this. And Frazier was reacting and slipping shots from Ali and Bugner who are much faster than Foreman. Usyk would catch him a lot but Usyk doesn't have the power to keep Frazier off of him

 

Not just that but the Nistor, Medzhidov and Beterbiev fights as well. Usyk doesn't like swarmers and tends to have a ton of trouble dealing with body shots on the inside. I'd pick him to beat Frazier, but if anyone is going to get to him it's Smoking Joe.