Who ranks higher all-time

Toney

 

James Toney's Best wins

Evander Holyfield = Holyfield was old and past his best but i still give Toney credit for being only the 2nd man to stop Holyfield, which is some feat considering Bowe was the only other man to do it and that was against a Holyfield with Hepatitis who was clearly way under par.

Mike McCallum x2 = I don't really count their 3rd fight but the first two fights were against good versions of McCallum even if he was in his mid 30s.

Michael Nunn = Stand out win Nunn was P4P number 3 and 36-0 i don't believe McCallum has any win over a top 10 P4P fighter which is another good argument in favour of Toney.

Prince Charles Williams = Alot more known for his Light Heavyweight feats than Super Middleweight and a bit past his best, but still a solid win for Toney against a former Light Heavyweight champion who made 8 title defences.

Tim Littles = Another solid win for Toney against an undefeated Littles who had a good Amateur background and solid wins as a pro against John Scully & Frankie Liles who went on to have a nice little run as Super Middleweight.

Iran Barkley = A bit past his prime but was coming off good wins vs Hearns, Van Horn, a very solid win for Toney in his best performance of his career.

Reggie Johnson = Another very good win for Toney against a very talented Johnson who won world titles in 2 different weightclasses.

Vassiliy Jirov = One of Toney's best wins against the best Cruiserweight in the world at that time 33-0 with a very good Amateur background also top 5 best Cruiserweight fight of all time.

Overall Toney won titles at Middleweight, Super Middleweight, Cruiserweight, and won 12 world title fights.

Pros for Toney

Had more success than McCallum in 4 different weightclasses compared to 3 for McCallum.

Actually beat McCallum in a H2H match up leading 2-0-1

Has the only win vs a top 10 P4P fighter in Michael Nunn.

Mike McCallum's Best wins

Ayub Kalue = A solid win for McCallum against a former Jr Middleweight champion despite Kalule coming off a loss to Moore he did go on to beat Kalambay after the McCallum loss.

Julian Jackson = A good win against arguably the hardest hitting Jr Middleweight of all time, Jackson was a bit green at this stage but still a very impressive early stoppage for McCallum.

Milton McCrory = A solid win against the former Welterweight champion McCrory wasn't really known for his feats at Jr Middleweight but still a solid win overall.

Donald Curry = The same as McCrory a former Welterweight champion who is more known for his feats at Welterweight than Jr Middleweight, but Curry was a bigger name than McCrory plus Curry did actually win a world title at Jr Middleweight. So i'll rate this as a good win even if Curry was a bit past his best and fighting at a weightclass that wasn't his most notable one.

Herol Graham = A good win over a very tricky/talented opponent never won a world title but still showed he was world class.

Michael Watson = Another good win against a talented British fighter who never won a world title, but Watson showed he was world class in beating Benn and in 2 meetings vs Eubank.

Sumbu Kalambay = 1-1 with Kalmbay in their 1st meeting McCallum got schooled but managed to win a close decision in the rematch, i think Kalambay was a bit past his best at this point when they fought the 2nd time and had suffered the 1 round loss to Nunn. But i still rate it as a good win for McCallum against one of the better former Middleweight champions of the last 40 years or so.

Steve Collins = Collins was green at this point only having 17 professional fights and would certainly improve after this fight, but still a solid win against a fighter that would go on to have very good success beating Benn, Eubank.

Jeff Harding = A very solid win for McCallum at almost 40 years old winning a world title in his 3rd weightclass beating the very tough rugged Australian.

Overall McCallum won 3 world titles in 3 different weightclass and won 15 world title fights.

Pros for Mike McCallum

Was more consistent than Toney and didn't have poor performances against much lesser opposition like Thadzi, Tiberi.

Won more world title fights than Toney did.

 

McCallum for me.

 

Nice job with this. Too me, it's McCallum all day. He was simply more consistent and never really looked bad until he was pushing 40. I also think their series should have been 1-1-1 as opposed to 2-0-1 for Toney.

 

McCallum but it’s a fair case either way.

 

McCallum had better class wins to me, but Toney went up in weight and was able to have some decent wins over guys up there, both of em have a case.
I feel like McCallum would've had even more if he didn't age so badly, he gave RJJ more trouble than Toney did and he was far outside of his prime.

 

Toney was better for his achievements at multiple weight classes but McCallum was better at middleweight imo though Toney has the better wins between the two.

 

I'd say McCallum narrowly but i don't think there's much of anything in it.

 

Toney for me because of his overall career but McCallum is not far behind. I do think McCallum was hurt by being on the outside of the fab 4 in that a fight would not generate much money interest at least that was the thinking of the time by some but he was certainly in their class...had he gotten the opportunity to fight the top guys in his prime it could be going the other way. Either way MM is an ATG who could fight in any era competitively and win.

 

He could've had a fight with Hearns if they didn't come out of the same stable. Even Steward himself said that McCallum would've won.

 

Wow, what a tough one. 50/50 to me. I think Mike was more consistent and he fought ina tougher era beating Milt and Donald and winning 3 titles, so did James. It is tough. Mike barely.

 

Where did Steward say Mike would have won? I am not sure of that statement.

 

I remember him saying something like that around the time McCallum went into the hall of fame. He didn't come right out and say Hears would lose but the he phrased it in a way that they wanted no part of him. McCallum spent a lot of time at Kronk and he beat the **** out of McCory who was one of Manny's top guys.

 

He doesn't quite say it here but if you read between the lines.

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• GEOFFHAYES
  Juy Hayes
  
  
  
  
  
  
  
  
  
  
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  #1
  Manny Steward on Mike McCallum
  10-05-2006, 03:11 PM
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  DI: "You've managed or trained over 20 world champions, some of them are already enshrined here at the Hall of Fame, and you were inducted in 1996. They may have to build a special Emanuel Steward wing just for you and your fighters! How does it make you feel to see one of your guys get inducted here, like Mike McCallum will be this year?"
  
  Emanuel Steward: "It makes me feel extremely good because in Mike McCallum's case in particular here's a fighter that never got any recognition at all. He was always going from one person to another (trainers, managers, promoters)-didn't stay long with anyone-and to now see him get this recognition means a lot to him-maybe more so than anyone who's being inducted this year. He was a great champion-many people only remember him knocking out Donald Curry. I don't remember ever seeing him on the cover of a major boxing ****zine. Ever. That's very unusual. He fought so many guys in their hometowns or even their home countries. He never had a home base like say Tommy Hearns did with Detroit. He just fought anybody, anywhere, under whatever conditions and prevailed all the way 'till he was really never beaten. His age really only caught up with him. But to see him enshrined means a great deal to him because he never got the recognition or the super fight with Leonard, Duran, Hagler-none of those guys-which I think he'd have been 50-50 to beat any of them!"
  
  DI: "Boxing insiders always loved Mike "The Body Snatcher" McCallum, but many fight fans don't know much about him. Do you have any interesting stories involving Mike?"
  
  ES: "I signed Mike and moved him into the number-one spot, and we were supposed to fight Roberto Duran. Then Duran's people told me (they weren't) going to fight Mike McCallum. I said, 'What do you mean, we have a contract, he's the number-one contender!' Duran just had a good fight with Hagler and lost a close decision, and they wanted to make a rematch. With McCallum, they would only make $500,000, but with a rematch with Hagler, they would make $5 million. So, I made a deal that Duran would fight Tommy Hearns, but Duran would have to give up his WBA title. I allowed Duran to fight Tommy and make more money than Tommy, but the bout would only be for Tommy's title. I made him give up the belt so Mike could fight for that vacant title. So, Mike was gonna fight Sean Mannion for the title on the under card of Duran/Hearns. I was using Tommy to get him his title shot because they were not gonna let him have it. It was advertised as being a double-header with Hearns/Duran for the WBC title and McCallum/Mannion for the WBA title, and I told him that under these conditions if Duran won, he would have to give McCallum a shot.
  
  Anyway, we all agreed. Mike was getting $250,000 and keeping all of it-as his manager I wasn't taking anything-and then suddenly he gets a phone call from Shelly Finkel telling him that I was screwing him and so on. I explained to him that I thought I was doing the safest thing for him that would guarantee him a title shot. We had an argument, and he ends up pulling out of the card. That's why when you saw the Hearns/Duran fight it was only for Tommy's title even though they were both champions. It should have been a title unification, but that's what we sacrificed to get Mike his shot. He didn't want to fight on the card, so later on the fight takes place, and he ends up fighting for about $30,000. He won the title, but shortly after that we severed our relationship because I got to realize that he always talked to everyone. He was always looking for advice, and when you do that you stay confused.
  
  People don't know that even though Tommy was the star at the Kronk, Mike was the one I was the closest with-he was my close buddy. I mean almost every night I went out to eat, wherever I went, Mike was with me. We got to be that close-not Tommy-Mike and I were much closer. I've watched his career as it went on, and I was right there in the front row when he knocked out Donald Curry with a beautiful, picture-perfect left hook.
  
  The main thing that I remember about Mike is he's the most naturally gifted fighter that ever walked into my gym. He did everything effortlessly. I mean he was just so smooth, so automatic. You would show him a little trick, and . well here's a good example. One day he was boxing with Tommy, and I said to him, 'I'm gonna show you a little trick. Tommy jabs with his left hand down, so I want you to parry it and step over real smooth, and shoot a little one, two and hit him on the chin.' He hit him three consecutive times, and finally Tommy stopped and said, 'How come I can't stop him from hitting me?' And everyone laughed! He did it so smooth-and I've shown that to a lot of fighters-but no one was ever able to do it, and he could hit anybody to the body! The workouts between Mike and Tommy were just unbelievable. They were better than most fights. They were just phenomenal!
  
  I felt that when Lennox was fighting Tyson, all the people were putting the emphasis on Ronnie Shields as the new trainer, but I thought the biggest threat was Mike McCallum in Tyson's camp. I was more afraid of the tricks he could teach Mike Tyson than anyone else! In fact, when we were in training, Lennox even said to me, 'What do you think McCallum's teaching him?' You know, because he knew I had so much respect for him. I said, 'Well, naturally he's gonna show him how to work the angles so he can get in and work the body.' So we spent a lot of time working to neutralize that. There was no other technique that we were concerned about other than making sure that Tyson didn't become a body snatcher himself that night, and it worked out perfect. But, Mike is a very good trainer now, and I got a bunch of kids ready to turn pro, and I'm getting ready to manage and promote more, and I'd love to have Mike train some kids for me.
  
  To have Lennox beat Tyson in such a total mismatch-he followed orders perfectly. Everything he did was right, so this was, to me, the highlight of my career as a trainer. I was totally, personally satisfied with that particular performance."
  
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• K-DOGG
  Mitakuye Oyasin
  
  
  
  
  
  
  
  
  
  
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  #2
  10-05-2006, 03:32 PM
  Excellent interview snibbit.
  
  I never knew the complete story on why Duran didn't have the WBA belt when he fought Hearns.
  
  I always thought Hearns and McCallum would have made a helluva match...too bad they probably didn't video tape any of their sparring sessions.
  
  For what it's worth, I think McCallum would have given both Hagler and Leonard fits as well...could have beaten both.....and would have beaten Duran IMHO.