Who ranks higher on your ATG List. Oscar De La Hoya or Floyd Mayweather Jr

We can talk all day about a "PRIME DLH"....and how incredible the guy was. We could add another week analyzing ALL the TOP shelf fighters he tangled with....but the topic is his ATG standing compared to Floyd.

Look....my favorite fighter over the last 20 years has been Oscar. I'm even willing to admit I'm a little biased when he's the topic of discussion....but his ambition and commitment to fighting the best had TWO effects....GOOD & BAD. It was a double edged sword for the Golden Boy.

He absolutely has one of the...if not "THE TOUGHEST" resume in the last 30 years..EASILY. He's faced more champions, former champion, hall of famers and future hall of famers than ANYONE ELSE in that time frame.

However.....Prime or not....DLH lost some of his most important fights. We can argue about his Prime..when he peaked and at what weight he was at his very best (I agree DLH was at his best at 147) but on this topic of if he ranks higher or lower than Floyd on the ATG list, those loses hurt him.

The fact that ALL of his "L's" came at the hand of justified ATG's and some of his losses were actually "WINS", helps but not enough to erase the fact that he just wasn't able to get wins in MOST his career defining fights.

I may have Floyd higher in the ATG rankings....but ask me who wins head to head in their primes....Floyd or DLH? Based on what I saw at 154 I have no doubt that a prime DLH would have beaten Floyd who could only get a SD against an older, past his prime Oscar.

 

Funny, I can't take a guy who's rocked a Broner avatar and before that a Mayweather avatar seriously either. I have serious trouble taking a guy who's argued Pacquiao didn't beat Bradley seriously. You have a very obvious agenda when you post, so I don't really take any of your posts all that seriously. The gist is generally "#slickblack, #floydag, #blat" right? Did I miss anything you one-dimensional little dickriding mongrel?

Sure, I've got an Oscar avatar. He's one of my favorites, I enjoyed watching him, but that doesn't affect my ability to judge him subjectively. He lost to Sturm clearly. I won't argue he'd beat a huge host of ATGs and is a GOAT contender like you and your fellow Floyd fans like to argue at times.

I've never said anywhere that Floyd isn't the best defensive fighter of his era. He is. I denied tliang's ludicrous statement that he's the most skilled fighter ever, which isn't true, subjective, and impossible to prove or disprove anyway largely because of competition level. I've never said he wouldn't be elite in other eras. I've even said in some of my other posts that he has a strong case to be the H2H GOAT at 130. You probably missed that because you were too busy being a nuthugger to even read opposing posts.

And seriously? Level of competition doesn't matter? Sure... You're going to tell me Calzaghe is better than Roy and Hopkins, right? Of course you won't. He even has the "0" but he's not part of your agenda.

Floyd has stood out in the higher divisions in part because of a weak era, and in part because he won't fight anybody he thinks might have a chance of beating him. He'd be great 130-135 any time, maybe at 140 as well. But you're kidding yourself if you think he'd be unbeaten at 147 and 154 in a tougher era. You overrate the **** out of him head to head at those weights. He's still good, but his resume just doesn't match up to his skills, both because of competition faced and competition available to face that he didn't face.

I did a competition level breakdown earlier in this thread that was conveniently ignored by you and every other nuthugger on your side. Floyd's resume is pretty thin in a lot of ways; his two best wins are Corrales and a badly faded Oscar that he still had a tough time with. Oscar has better wins and has been proven against a higher competition level. He has a better resume. Moreover, prime Oscar fought nothing like the shell Floyd fight. Prime Oscar was a top-notch fighter, and his greater size and physical attributes, coupled with his still-impressive skill level, make him a better H2H fighter at the higher weights than Floyd is, where he's relatively unproven and hasn't looked as good as he did at 130-135, like it or not.

I've given Floyd his props before. I respect how he fought Castillo again immediately to rectify that dubious verdict. But he's not the same guy he was earlier in his career. As a fight fan, it's infuriating to watch all the fake retirement bull**** and all of the fights he's missed out on making since leaving 135. But, you're not really a fan of the sport; you're a one-dimensional spam bot. That's why I can't take you seriously.

 

Floyd because of his dominance in the sport from then until now.

 

Great response for an undefeated record !

 

He's better boxer than Oscar. Better defense, more accurate, faster, more efficient, better footwork, More agility, better endurance, better stamina, better athleticsm, better reflexes. If you watch tape, it easy to see Floyd is a better boxer.

 

But all the guys you mentioned like Ali, Robinson, Louis, Armstrong all Clearly Won Most of their big fights. Oscar didn't, you can argue that he lost the majority of his big fights, when it came to the big moments he came up Short.

 

I love when *****s can't respond with actual skills and 90% of their post consist of "speed, reflexes, stamina, endurance, agility." I'll list them again, try this:

 

Prime for Prime....DLH was just as good as Floyd.. Just different styles. DLH was just as talented. He was just as fast in his hay day with incredible reflexes. But his style was that of a classic boxer/puncher. He had more power than Floyd and his defense was VERY good...Floyd is on another level defensively but DLH was a much more productive offensive force than Floyd. I wouldn't say Floyd is a better boxer at all...he's got a different style.

 

Oscar's punch selection wasn't that varied. For the majority of his career(before he got with Mayweather Sr), he was a one handed fighter. His offense wasn't dynamic at all.

You have brought this lateral movement thing up once before and I commented, but Floyd when he wants to can turn pressure guys all day. Floyd vs Jesus Chavez,Jose Luis Castillo, and Baldomir. If Floyd doesn't want to be found, he won't be found.

 

His defense was not very good....and it's nowhere near Floyd's...probably because Floyd takes far fewer risks(when Floyd does open up, he gets hit a lot)

Power is Oscar's only advantage. Talent wise, Mayweather is a level above.

 

Oscar's combination punching is still more varied. Uppercuts, body punches to either side, lefts and rights, etc., all mixed in variation. I wouldn't call him an ATG combinatino puncher, and while Floyd can throw every punch well, I don't consider him to be super dynamic offensively. Pull-counter, straight or jab to the body, check and lead left hooks, etc.

Floyd can disengage really well and circle, but DLH can get offense going on the move in a way Floyd generally doesn't (Trinidad, Vargas.)

My only point in highlighting these observations is that Floyd doesn't do every single thing better than everybody else that ever fought. Different styles, different priorities, different advantages & weaknesses.

 

Floyd's offense is just as basic as Oscar's(hell, maybe even more)...but it's consistently more effective against any style.

Floyd's straight right off the back foot is terrific. Very well timed and slips out a a perfect angle to land it again. Obviously the check hook is well documented too.

He absolutely doesn't. He has holes like everyone else. He gets frustrated at tight defenses. Reaches with punches with his chin up. Doesn't commit to the body enough. Flat footed. Struggles when given angles. He just masks his weaknesses better than most.

 

:good

 

DLH had very good defense.....his stats prove that....even Floyd had a lot of trouble landing how shots on Oscar when DLH was past his best. Of course he's not as good defensively as Floyd but not many are. DLH and Floyd have an abundance of talent.

DLHs Defense is more subtle....but its effective.

 

Agreed. DLH is very effective at parrying off punches, even from Floyd. In fact, Floyd looked more busted up in their fight than Oscar. Floyd might have scored more points, but Oscar managed to land some very nice shots, swell Floyd's eye and bust up Floyd's nose.

There's a reason why Oscar doesn't slurr like Mosley and other fighters from his era who got hit a lot. Oscar depite having a great chin had very effective defense.