Who ranks Higher on your ATG List? Whitaker or Hagler?

Crazy ass thread.

 

This.

:thumbsup

 

Whitaker is 19th in my ATG list. Hagler is 23rd.


Subject to change as I learn more/reflect more, but overall this is what it looks like:
1. SRR
2. Armstrong
3. Ali
4. Louis
5. Greb
6. Duran
7. Fitzsimmons
8. B.Leonard
9. Charles
10. Langford
11. S.R.Leonard
12. Moore
13. Monzon
14. Pep
15. Gans
16. Wilde
17. Napoles
18. Chavez
19. Whitaker
20. Walker
21. Tunney
22. Ross
23. Hagler

 

:nut

A past it, cracked out Whitaker who sustained a broken jaw in the 6th round.

 

lolz Like I said, could be changed haha, but right now I don't see how I could change mine as of yet.

 

Right.

You could very well argue Pernell Whitaker is the fourth greatest lightweight of all-time right behind the likes of Leonard, Gans, Duran. There hasn't been an Undisputed 135 champion since him over 20 years ago, and when he unified he was the first since Roberto Duran himself accomplished it in his last fight at the weight in 1978, beating the likes of Azumah Nelson, Jose Luis Ramirez (x2), Greg Haugen, Roger Mayweather, Juan Nazario.

So with that in mind, consider that he also went and captured titles at 140, 147, and 154. Both McGirt at WW and Vasquez at LMW were the #1 rated fighters in those divisions respectively - McGirt was also the Lineal Champ and amongst the top four P4P in the sport at the time (See his work against Simon Brown to get a good grasp on the quality of fighter he was, or just watch the first bout with Whitaker himself). Vasquez was a significantly bigger man and well established in the division with ten defenses of his strap and wins over an undefeated Winky Wright, Aaron Davis, Javier Castillejo among others. The win over a fading, but still P4P #1 Chavez is easily one of the greatest of the last 25-30 years and in arguably the most significant fight of the decade. Was Chavez at his best at Welterweight? Obviously not, but it wasn't exactly a full fledged 147 bout either (Whitaker 145, Chavez 142). JCC had fought above Light Welter 11 times prior to then going 11-0 (11 KOs). Then consider that a past-prime Whitaker after having shown serious decline against Rivera and Hurtado gave De La Hoya all the could handle despite no longer being able to sustain his offensive arsenal and work rate.

Chavez
De La Hoya (arguably)
Nelson
McGirt (x2)
Vasquez
Ramirez (x2)

Outside of Thomas Hearns obviously, which are Hagler's best victories? He has one of the most wildly undefined CV's regarding his Top 5-6 wins as any ATG I've seen. You pose this question to a group of fans and the answers are wildly inconsistent and really all over the map. I'm not so sure that's a great thing. After all, his case thus far in the thread has been that he dominated the MW division and was more exciting to watch.

Also, if you want to see dominance of a different variety, Whitaker's performances against Nelson, Ramirez II, Haugen, Chavez, Nazario (actually a very short night) all fit the bill. You want to see him go toe-to-toe often, the second McGirt fight offers that and could really be placed in the aforementioned group. See him knocked around and need a KO to win, Hurtado. Or if you doubt his 'toughness', watch a shot incarnation go the distance with prime Tito Trinidad after having broken his jaw in the sixth round.

Hagler lost to a one-eyed, coked out natural welterweight and got taken the distance by a fat ass, past his prime lightweight. :rofl So it's really fitting that you could talk about how a bunch of natural welters and sub-welters would do against him. He wanted no part of Michael Spinks either. :shock: