Who Rates Higher as a ATG? Ali or Duran?

Duran maybe the greatest lightweight of all time but Ali is arguably the best HW of all time.
Yes there is Joe Louis, but Ali's resume was ridiculous and to think that we never got to see Ali in his actual prime...
Ali's wins over Foreman, Frazier and Liston outweigh Durans wins over SRL,Buchanan,De Jesus

 

Ali has wins over potentially 3 top 10 Heavyweights, and some of the best ever contender level fighters in the division.

 

Could easily be argued either way.

 

no way!! Ali was a real legend with suberb wins!!! Frazier Norton Foreman Spinks Liston patterson --and Duran???? Well he beat leonard!

 

Duran beat 15 fighters better than Leon Spinks.

It's also arguable that Ali lost all 3 fights to Norton.......

No right or wrong answer here gents.

 

Wow, am i really the only 1 that voted Duran. Ok, i'll explain. But first, here is my 10 top ATG list.

Greb
Robinson
Armstrong
Langford
Duran
Charles
Bobby Fitz
Ali
Pep
Gans/Benny Leonard/ Camzoneri/Louis (it changes every day tbh).

Right, so why do i rate Duran above Ali. First thing here, I think Duran is the most skilled boxer to ever lace on the gloves. His come forward agressive stye was made all the more intimidating by his 'hands of stone'. The key here, however, is his subtle defensive masterclass he often put on while coming forward. A slight turn of the head when an opponent threw a shot, slighting stepping back/forward half a foot, often meant opponents didnt land cleanly on him. He was as rough as they come, but was no slugger. His infighting was superb, defensive underrated, and power in both hands with a chin to match. So, lets look at his record. Firstly, if you want to see Duran at his best, I suggest everyone watches him vs Carlos Palomino. for me, it was his best ever performance, a real clinic and a treat to watch.

At LW, he had notable wins over the underrated Marcel (who was favourite going in with Duran who was only 16-0 at the time), Estaban (twice) the Viruet brothers, Bizzarro, Mamby, Lampkin, Kobyashi and the very very good Buchanan. Then, he steps up in wieght to defeat the aforemented Palomino, before possibly the greatest win of all time against a prime leonard. Make no mistake, he was 72-1-0 in his prime for a reason. A former undisputed LW champion then steps up against the bigger guys in Hearns (top 5 154 lb-er) Benetiz (154), he ran Hagler close at 160 (if it was a 12 round fight, he probably gets the nod), destroys Davey Moore at 154, and wins a version of the middleweight world title against Barkely (again, not bad for a guy who started at 120lbs and was a prime 135 lber). Yes he lost to Laing, Wilfred and was blown away by Tommy (tommy beats him 10/10 due to styles), but he more than held his own against one of the great MWs (who had ruled for 7 years), and proved his class when we beat Barkley when he was completely shot.

Now, Ali was Ali, and had very very good wins (which helps him pip Joe Louis as my number 1 HW). Wins over Foreman, Norton, Liston, Frazier (I discount the Archie Moore win due to hi being shot to ****, but we can include it if you want), which is an exceptional resume by any standards. A brash, underrated hitting, quick heavyweight with one of the great chins ever, but for me, Duran nicks it in terms of ability.

While Ali/Clay is favourible against pretty much every other HW, Duran more than holds his own against every other LW, and gets the better of Pea, Benny and Gains over a 3 fight trilogy. His overrall come forward style is accompanied with hands of stone and underrated defensive ability. He has the better single win on his resume (Leonard rather than the Thriller/The Rumble take your pick). There was just something very very special about Roberto. Ali was awesome, but Duran is ahead of him in my p4p rankings

 

For anyone interested in seriously discussing this, I started a thread in the British not too long ago entitled 'Is Roberto Duran the greatest boxer since Sugar Ray Robinson'.

Here's the link.
[url]http://www.eastsideboxing.com/forum/showthread.php?t=341213[/url]

There are some very very good points in the thread. Take a look through

 

Top post Vano, i cant pick who has the better resume it is so close. Could be argued either way :good

 

:deal ATG British thread :yep

 

p4p top 10 thread :yep

 

Ali for me, although I like Duran better.

 

Buchanan will always hang over Durans head. Never gave the man a rematch when he clearly was in big trouble and fouled him for the win. Not saying he wasn't an ATG but just like the current Khan/Prescott debacle, past issues should be resolved, especially as Buchanan was a superb boxer. Ali never had that stigma. I would favor Ali.

 

Oh, I don't know, I'd ask Kenny about that, mate.

 

Duran proved he was above Buchanan with wins over Estaban and Leonard. I'm not sure past issues need to be resolved if you prove beyond doubt. Even still, Duran was ahead on all 3 cards going into the 13th. Kenny was tired and Duran was finishing the stronger