Who should Jack Dempsey have given title matches to after beating Willard in 1919?

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by Mendoza, Feb 22, 2019.


  1. Mendoza

    Mendoza Hrgovic = Next Heavyweight champion of the world. banned Full Member

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    Who should Jack Dempsey have given title matches to after beating Willard in 1919?

    1920 - Miske was ill and sick at this point in time. Why not a rematch with Willie Meehan, who had defeated Dempsey twice in the past? A win here would have enhanced his resume. Most champions take an easy first title defense.

    1920 - Bill Brennan was a solid choice. Indeed he gave Dempsey a hard time.

    1920: Give Fireman Flynn another crack. Average a first round Ko loss.

    1921 - Carpentier. This match made sense. Carpentier was in his prime and on a winning streak. He was doing fine and landing on Dempsey until injuring his hand/wrist.

    1922 - Dempsey did not fight this year! Meanwhile, Harry Greb, defeated Tunney, Loughran, and Gibbons in 1922. This would have been a good match, Dempsey ducked Greb thought his tenure as champion.

    1923 - Harry Wills. Avoiding the #1 contender for thee years = a duck. It would have been a super fight. Wills was undoubtedly the best opponent out there for Dempsey. If NY State said no, just pick another venue. Simple.

    1923 - Firpo was a good choice. A hyped puncher who maybe beat one person who would have been in the top ten previously to facing Dempsey.

    1924 - Gibbons, who was ring rated #3 at this point in time, a fine choice. Just hire a better cameraman, okay? Gibbons went the distance, and was perhaps qualifies as Dempsey's best title win. IMO Gibbons is not a top 50 all time heavyweight.

    1925 - Dempsey tool this year off. A re-match with Firpo would a have been nice to clear up the assistance of being knocked out of the ring. I think this fight would have produced a large gate.

    1926 - Tunney schools him.

    Had Dempsey fought Wills and Greb, his resume of opponents would have been greatly enhanced! If he won both, Dempsey could say he was the best out there for a while, with a win over a top 30 ATG. Conversely, if he lost one, or both his resume slides backward. We'll never know. History shows two large holes in his resume because these matches did not happen.

    Avenging losses to Meehan and Flynn would have helped as the results look a bit embarrassing in modern times. I think Dempsey would have won these matches.

    What do you think? In your opinion who should Dempsey have fought in this title matches?
     
    Last edited: Feb 22, 2019
  2. mcvey

    mcvey VIP Member Full Member

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    You think Dempsey should have defended his title against Flynn in1920 ?

    1. Flynn stopped Dempsey in1917
    2.Dempsey ko'd Flynn in 1 rd in1918! I think that counts as avenging the loss the previous year!
    3.Flynn had a further 2 fights in1918,he lost to nobody Hugh Walker and was ko'd in2 rds by Billy Miske.
    4.1919 Flynn lost to Jimmy Darcy twice. He was stopped by Fat Larue in2 rds! Beaten by Jerry Schuman in2rds and beaten by Ole Anderson in 4rds
    5.In1920 Flynn had 6 fights and won 1 of them ,losing 4, he was 40 years old.
    And you think these results indicate he was a credible opponent for Dempsey in a title fight in1920?
    I think you have finally flipped!!!!
     
    Last edited: Feb 22, 2019
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  3. Seamus

    Seamus Proud Kulak Full Member

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    The Carpentier match was indefensible outside of providing a good storyline. The Orchid Man hadn't even beaten a second rate heavyweight in 8 or so years and himself was ducking Greb.
     
  4. Webbiano

    Webbiano Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    For as easy as it is to bash Dempsey for his title reign and opposition, had he faced Greb and actually beat him, his legacy only gets enhanced by the hardcore boxing fans and even most of us would still be sceptical about the quality of the win, due to the difference on the scales
     
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  5. mcvey

    mcvey VIP Member Full Member

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    But it was a million dollar gate!
     
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  6. mcvey

    mcvey VIP Member Full Member

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    If Dempsey had defended against Greb and beat him up, Mendoza would be the first clown on this forum saying Greb was only a middleweight!
     
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  7. Seamus

    Seamus Proud Kulak Full Member

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    Tex was a genius who knew a good storyline and how to sell it. He would be King in this era of 24 hr saturation, 30 second news cycles and ubiquitous social media.
     
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  8. mcvey

    mcvey VIP Member Full Member

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    Yes indeedy!
     
  9. janitor

    janitor VIP Member Full Member

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    I think that the original plan of Fulton fighting wills, and Dempsey facing the winner, was a sound one.
     
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  10. janitor

    janitor VIP Member Full Member

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    There I would have to disagree.

    Carpintier was the European Heavyweight Champion, and the lineal Light Heavyweight Champion, either one of which could have justified the fight being made.

    The problem is not that Dempsey fought Carpintier, it is that he didn't fight certain other people!
     
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  11. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    Yeah, i agree that GC is OK if he's a busy champion taking on top guys.

    It's only the circumstances of his reign that make people fume.
     
  12. BitPlayerVesti

    BitPlayerVesti Boxing Drunkie Full Member

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    The only issue I really have was him not fighting Wills. Him fighting Greb would've been nice too.
     
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  13. mcvey

    mcvey VIP Member Full Member

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    Dempsey was making a hell of a lot of money from short one reelers and public appearances,he did what most of the champions before him had done . That doesn't excuse his lack of defences, nor his failure to meet Wills, but in that he was hardly unique.
     
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  14. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    Yeah, lots of guys ducked lots of guys.

    I think Dempsey's title reign was the most miserable, personally, but that's up for debate too. Johnson's was awful. Corbett.
     
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  15. mcvey

    mcvey VIP Member Full Member

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    None of the three were stellar, but for some different reasons imo.Though race played a major part in all of the decisions that were unfortunately taken.