Who Thinks Jack Johnson Could Step Out Of A Time Machine And Fight For A Belt?

Jack Johnson was a truly great fighter, and the true greats will always be competitive in any era. Johnson's boxing techniques were optimized for the rules and allowances of his era, however, and he wouldn't be as successful in any other era as he was in his own, given our hypothetical Wayback Machine.

Heck, one of Johnson's most effective infighting techniques - grabbing his opponent's wrist or elbow in a clinch (forcing his opponents to concentrate on something other than protecting their faces) is physically impossible with modern equipment, not even considering its illegality.

 

When you’re fighting older or much smaller white hopes, a fighter can get away with low hands and pulling straight back. In these fights, Johnson's fundamental flaws of having a low guard, remaining stationary for long periods of time and pulling straight back worked. Yet against Jess Willard landed a good amount of punches from the outside. Willard was never much a of a boxer, and was one of the slower heavyweight champions. But he was much bigger and had greater reach. Johnson could not rely on his old tactics. If Willard could exploit these flaws, fighters like Klitschko, Mercer, or Holmes would have field days.

The irony is most boxing historians are well versed on Johnson the man, but completely miss understand Johnson’s style in the ring. Johnson was a much better in-fighter than out fighter on all of his films. But he clinched a lot and didn’t throw many punches. Such a formula combined with his technical flaws on defense would spell disaster. The question to ask here is could Johnson adapt to modern boxing? I beleive he could since he was a great athlete, but if a supper middle weight could knock him out and Ketchel could hurt him and put him down, a modern heavyweight puncher would likely do even worse.

 

The jab has been thrown exactly the same way since the begining of time. Do you think that one day some bright spark said-

"I know I will just use the jab as my primary weapon"

And thus a new era began?

 

How the mechanics of a punch can "evolve" is beyond me.

Apparently Johnson could defend against the early 1900's jabs, but would be mystified by Klitshko's "modern" jab. I'm presuming our poster believes Klitschko has had an explosive rocket fuel delivery system and homing device built into his left arm?

 

What makes you think that these are flaws?

Getting hit in the solar plexus with a 4oz glove would be like being hit with a ballpeen hamer. The low guard simply relects this.

Do you think that some bright spark had the idea of holding his hands a bit higher one day and thus a new era was born?

Being economical with footwork is a good idea if you have to last 45 rounds.

These tactics are not primitive they are more adaptations to a diferent set of circumstances.

 

Thanks.

 

Modern heavyweights aren't well-conditioned enough to keep their hands up consistently, like say Juan Diaz or Winky Wright. Nor are they well conditioned enough to use the ring (and movement) effectively, like say Mayweather or Freitas.

To criticize these "fundamental flaws" in Johnson is a little strange to me. He was excellent at parrying punches (see his fight Vs Moran), so obviously he was doing something right with regards to avoiding being hit, even if his hand placement wasn't "conventional".

You think Willard "exploited flaws"? The only flaw Willard exploited was in the treatment of Johnson the man, which saw him kicked out his own country and depressed. He was in horrible condition going into the fight and still beat Willard over the first 20 rounds - His downfall was his conditioning. And I believe 20 rounds would be the downfall of ANY modern heavyweight.

Oh and pulling straight back from straight punches is not textbook but tends to work for fighters with exceptional reflexes, old or modern.

 

Yes, very good points.

 

Johnson would have done well in any era, he just had the talent.

 

very astute comments!

 

If you don't believe the jab has change with time, give me a few examples of boxers with good modern jabs, in Johnson's era. Lets cut out all the pathetic Williard ones, eh? Strong, offensively dominating jabs.

There simply isn't a boxer whose jab could compete with someone like Holmes'.

The style is based too much off the back foot for it even to be contemplated.

 

Dempsey said a thud reverberated very loudly as Joe Gans stepped into his jab (referred to as the falling step by Dempsey when describing the mechanics of a punch), giving it immense power. He stepped forward and launched the jab before his foot landed loudly on the ring surface.

Can you explain for me how this is jabbing off of the backfoot?

Fundamentally the jab hasn't changed, although it is used more extensively as an auxilliary weapon nowadays, to set up stronger punches, keep opponents off balance etc etc.

 

I hapen to think that Jack Johnson would match up verry well against Wladamir Klitschko incidentaly.

If I told him that he had to fight this big athletic oponent whose primary weapon was his jab he would say-

"No problem. The jab is the punch that will make me best able to counter with my right. Everytime he throws that jab he is going to be open to a counter."

If I then told him that this big athletic fighter did not have much of an uppercut he would think that all his christmases had come at once3.