Who was better out of Virgil Hill, Fabrice Tiozzo and Henry Maske at 175?

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by mark ant, Dec 25, 2018.



  1. Seamus

    Seamus Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Maske it is!

    I am glad we have reached consensus. It is truly rare. But then, a true great of the highest order almost demands such response.
     
  2. Oakland Billy Smith

    Oakland Billy Smith New Member Full Member

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    Vurgil Hill, hands down.
     
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  3. Ra's Al-Ghul

    Ra's Al-Ghul The One and Only Full Member

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    Ah so you want to get beaten up again (cause you miss it)...
    Maybe you should try to read the postings, before comment them? :idea: My point was, that he had a far better amateur career than Hill, let alone Tiozzo.

    And it will be kept your secret, how an undefeated contender as Duran Williams can be a journeyman (who was at that time IBF # 1).:rolleye:
    While Jonathan Corn didn't you even know.

    Which better challengers were available when at Light-Heavyweight than these which Maske had? Name me such or be sillent!

    While John "The Iceman" Scully was a stay busy fight and similar as Rick Thornberry, better than Tucker Pudwill or James John Crawford.

    Charles Williams was the best world champion at that time (in front of Hill and Harding), while Virgil Hill just won vacante titles against second tier opponents (like Frankie Swindell and David Vedder).
     
  4. mcvey

    mcvey Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    I couldn't care less about amateur fights.
    IBF lol Where was he ranked in any credible organization? Nowhere!
    Who did he beat? No one!
    No I didn't know Jonathan Corn, the guy who was kod 19 times ! Should I have done?Who the **** did he ever beat?
    You are a standing joke here ,do you realise that?
     
  5. Ra's Al-Ghul

    Ra's Al-Ghul The One and Only Full Member

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    You are not even a looney-tune, but a comidy figure: You don't go any deep in the contend and won't have a conversation, but just annoy as you can't answer my question.

    You pretend he only had the Prince in his record and anybody else were journeyman. But he fought Graziano Rocchigiani twice, outclassed Iran Barkley and Duran Williams had a record of 16 - 0 -1 (there had more opponents of Hill a journeyman record), while the IBF was not like the WBO or WBU (which were mostly used in Britain) nor paid by Sauerland, but one of the three rmajor bodies regareded, as the WBC and WBA.
    You are just a dirty lier!

    When you don't care about amateur achievement, why do you quote me about it here first?
    The answer is probably your agenda and propaganda...
     
  6. mcvey

    mcvey Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Explain who Williams beat to warrant a title shot?

    His previous 6 opponents had a total of119 fights between them and46 losses!
    His second to last opponent, before he challenged Maske for his paper crown was Vinson Durham his record was15-7-1 and it was a draw! Williams fought a bunch of patsies and third raters!
    Here are the stats of his opponents prior to Maske
    9-9-1
    15-7-1
    9-4-2
    10-9-1
    8-11-0
    16-6-2
    4-0-0
    10-34-4
    2-2-0
    8-7-1
    13-5-0
    6-2-0
    0-2-0
    3-0-0
    3-4-0
    0-1- 0
    Explain how beating these nobodies qualified him for a title chance?
    Maske defended against Williams in Feb 96,instead of fighting this unrated duck why didn't he fight:
    Hill
    Jones Jnr
    Griffin
    Toney
    Sosa
    Guthrie
    McCallum
    Tate
    Or Devalle?
    Barkley had been stopped by Adolpho Washington and James Toney the previous year and had done nothing to justify him receiving a title shot after that,nor was he ranked anywhere reputable.
     
    Last edited: Jan 2, 2019
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  7. Ra's Al-Ghul

    Ra's Al-Ghul The One and Only Full Member

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    First you have to answer which of Hills wins was better than Charles Williams, what I asked narrowly a week ago and you ignored (due to it doesn't suit your agenda)?

    By the way is the reason he wasn't ranked that high in the other bodies perhaps, that he had a shot for the IBF crown certain, therefore was he not available for the other title-holders; then get pulled these challengers either out or get downgraded in the lists.

    I think it was end of January (maybe 30. or 31.) and you are an idiot to name him unrated, as I explained numerous times he was number 1 contender at that time: How should he had done this, when it was obligated and Williams got already step-aside money to make Maske vs. Rocky II? He would have been stripped by the IBF then. Hill fought he at the end of the same year and the negotions were difficult (it got already delayed once, because of an injury), Jones was not in Light-Heavyweight (moved up narrowly one year later), Griffin fought Toney for the WBU joke title, Toney lost about three fights in row (is it that what qualifies for a title shot?) against average opposition, Sosa was in Super-Middleweight and just a gate-keeper, Guthrie was unknown and protected too (his opponents were not better than Williams, but he was older), McCallum fought Jones and was faded (had lost vs. Tiozzo last time), Tate was in Super-Middlweight, del Valle fought against Hill in that year.

    Barkley was defending his title against Toney and it was close to the Maske fight (one year previous), while he was more competitive there and vs. Washington than against Maske, who did just a voluntary defence. You know Holyfield lost against Moorer and Bowe before he faced Tyson, while Hopkins lost twice before he fought Tarver. It was more justified than Calzaghe defending against Brewer, who was in the fight before stopped by Echols (after losing the second Ottke fight) or Woodhall, having a year off after a soundful beating by Beyer.

    You call the IBF a paper crown... you are a grotesk creature.
     
    Last edited: Jan 3, 2019
  8. THE BLADE 2

    THE BLADE 2 Boxing Addict Full Member

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    I think Maske was not willing to face Toney because that fight was too risky. Maske preferred to fight another name American fighter in Barkley who was less dangerous. Just after Maske outpointing Duran Williams in a good competitive fight, I remember Toney knocking out Williams in an impressive performance.
     
  9. Ra's Al-Ghul

    Ra's Al-Ghul The One and Only Full Member

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    Then you remember wrong, as it was some years before and Williams was broken by Maske but more competitive with Toney, while he had to shrink down from his natural weight class (like Dawson did against Ward)...

    Barkley fit better in the Light-Heavyweight than Toney, as he was physical stronger, tougher and hit harder, just as was more rubust, as he stopped Hearns there. Toney had just lost against contender Griffin twice and journeyman Thadzi. So he was not ranked in any top 10 to challenge Maske, at that point. He was just not good enough for a title shot, apart of the WBU (neither Hil or Tiozzo fought him).
     
  10. Ra's Al-Ghul

    Ra's Al-Ghul The One and Only Full Member

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    No I mean the opposite, as I didn't agree with McDonkey, who actual alleged the IBF was a paper title, if you are able to read...
     
  11. mark ant

    mark ant Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Toney stopped Barkley at super-middle and Barkley didn`t stop Heans at light-heavy he beat on points three years after stopping him at middleweight where he was blown away by Benn in one round and floored by Duran while losing a split decision to him in 1989.
     
  12. mark ant

    mark ant Boxing Addict Full Member

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    It`s been a long day.:duh
     
  13. mark ant

    mark ant Boxing Addict Full Member

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    The IBF, WBO WBA were the three recognised titles during the 80`s, I don`t where you got your info that the IBF was considered a lesser title aside fromwhen the IBF was first formed, I don`t know if that`s what you mean, evey IBF champ considered themselves a real champ in the 80`s.
     
  14. Ra's Al-Ghul

    Ra's Al-Ghul The One and Only Full Member

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    But the point is, Barkley was more successful than Toney at Light-Heavyweight and had a longer campaign there, as the later one has possible a negative record in this division.
     
    Last edited: Jan 3, 2019
  15. mark ant

    mark ant Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Okay.
     

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