Who was really more deserving of a shot at Joe Louis?

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by mr. magoo, Jun 4, 2008.


  1. mr. magoo

    mr. magoo VIP Member Full Member

    50,867
    24,623
    Jan 3, 2007
    A lot of folks commonly credit Joe Louis as giving deserving challengers title shots, and furthermore rematches for good efforts. But, did all these guys really deserve second opportunities or even first ones to begin with?

    In 1941, Joe Louis fought a contender named Abe Simon. He gave Simon a second chance in 1942. Simon had been beaten prior to both occasions by Lem Franklin, including in the last fight leading up to Simon's second meeting with Louis.

    Should Lem Franklin have gotten a title shot before Simon did, and did Simon really deserve to fight Louis on two occasions?
     
  2. SuzieQ49

    SuzieQ49 The Manager Full Member

    37,077
    3,725
    Sep 14, 2005
    Yes Powerful Punching # 2 ranked Lem Franklin deserved a title shot over a Abe Simon Rematch.


    He deserved it the first time, but he did not deserve rematch
     
  3. janitor

    janitor VIP Member Full Member

    71,502
    27,038
    Feb 15, 2006
    For my money Lem Franklin would have been a more deserving challenger than Abe Simon though Simon was a decent oponent.

    Simon was a big draw among the jewish community which probably had more to do with him getting a rematch than any problems he gave Louis in their first meeting. The fight was devised to raise money for the army and navy relief fund and was something of an improvisation.

    Tommy Farr deserved a rematch because although he went on a loosing streak he manifestly deserved the decision in some of those fights. Louis had to work with the oficial verdicts of course.

    For my money the potential Louis oponent who got most shafted was Jimmy Bivins. He spent the war years building up his standing but when the war ended all prewar rankings were restored. This meant that fighters who had been inactive for the past four years were able to leapfrog over all the work he had done over this period.
     
  4. dabox

    dabox Active Member Full Member

    737
    10
    Oct 17, 2007
    can get some more info on Lem Franklin

    kinda hard to find out stuff on him
     
  5. mr. magoo

    mr. magoo VIP Member Full Member

    50,867
    24,623
    Jan 3, 2007
    I will always credit Louis for his dominance and impressively beating quality men such Schmeling, Walcott, B. Baer, M. Baer, Sharkey, Braddock and Carnera. He definately fought some very good fighters, but Simon simply was not one of them. Of course, any long term reigning champion is going to have a few weaker opponents on his record. Holmes, Ali, Tyson and Frazier all fought their share of less deserving challengers. Lem Franklin needed a title shot and I think that much is obvious. Simon was a very inconsistant fighter who actually went into his rematch with Louis having been Tko'd in his last fight by Franklin, and drawing with Turkey Thompson. Politics has always played a role in who gets the shot and who doesn't, but unfortunately such politics kept a number of the best black fighters in the 1940's down in the ratings.
     
  6. PhillyPhan69

    PhillyPhan69 Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

    18,091
    15,550
    Dec 20, 2006
    I agree that Franklin was more deserving of this shot than was simon (Although Janitor brough up an intersting twist)..But it is understandable why he did not recieve one after this as he had lost to Bob Pastor before the Simon/Louis fight ever took place...would lose agian 3 days after Louis/Simon II and go on to lose 6 of his next 7 fights and 7 of 9 to end his carear. So although at this time he probably at least deserved consideration it is easy to see why later he never got it!
     
  7. SuzieQ49

    SuzieQ49 The Manager Full Member

    37,077
    3,725
    Sep 14, 2005
    Potentially, but I think Elmer Ray and Lee Q Murray were just as shafted. especially ray.
     
  8. ChrisPontius

    ChrisPontius March 8th, 1971 Full Member

    19,404
    278
    Oct 4, 2005
    Pity he didn't fight Franklin, though the Simon rematch did bring some of the most beautiful displays of heavyweight punching skills i've ever seen.
     
  9. mr. magoo

    mr. magoo VIP Member Full Member

    50,867
    24,623
    Jan 3, 2007
    The same displays could have viewed by watching Louis pound an everlast heavybag.