Who was the #1 contender when Rocky Marciano fought Ezzard Charles?

The NYSAC WAS NOT the single most powerful sanctioning body at that time. You can think that, but it wasn't.

The NBA was boxing's ruling body at the time.

Ring Magazine was a magazine. It had no authority then. It has no authority now.

I don't know why you're arguing this.

 

I think you're right. Charles' win over Satterfield solidified his shot at the title. It came at just the right moment when they were trying to come up with an opponent for Marciano.

I disagree with your comments about Valdes. At that point, Valdes was just as qualified as Charles, that's why he was included as an outstanding contender.

If the fight would've taken place in Miami in February, it would've been Valdes or Bucceroni. (Norris preferred one of them over Charles). When it got pushed back, Charles made more sense.

It was all about timing. It wasn't that Valdes did something to disqualify himself.

 

Boxing News is still being published. It's the longest running boxing magazine.

http://www.boxingnewsonline.net/magazine/

http://www.boxingnewsonline.net/

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boxing_News

 

Where does Wlad sit?

Povetkin Ring # 1, Byrd Ring # 1, Pulev Ring # 1 I think

 

Wlad defended against 2 #1s in Povetkin and Pulev.

Byrd was the Champion.

 

"It had no authority then. It has no authority now."

Like the NBA.

The NYSAC is the body with "power" as you put it, as this is actually a governmental body with legal power. It was formed by an act of the New York State Legislature and the signature of the Governor. Its decisions had the weight of law in New York State.

Now New York State is only a single state, but in those days it held over ten per cent of the American population, and it was the financial and cultural capital of the country, and the capital of big-time boxing.

Here are the top five grossing fights of the 1930's, 1940's, 1950's

1930's

Louis-Schmeling (1938)--Yankee Stadium, NYC
Louis-Baer (1935)---------Yankee Stadium, NYC
Schmeling-Sharkey (1930)-Yankee Stadium, NYC
Louis-Braddock (1937)-----Comiskey Park, Chicago
Louis-Schmeling (1936)----Yankee Stadium, NYC

1940's

Louis-Conn (1946)--------Yankee Stadium, NYC
Louis-Walcott (1948)------Yankee Stadium, NYC
Louis-Nova (1941)---------Polo Grounds, NYC
Louis-Conn (1941)---------Polo Grounds, NYC
Zale-Graziano (1947)------Chicago Stadium, Chicago

1950's

Marciano-Moore (1955)----Yankee Stadium, NYC
Robinson-Turpin (1951)----Polo Grounds, NYC
Robinson-Basilio (1957)----Yankee Stadium, NYC
Marciano-Charles (1954)---Yankee Stadium, NYC
Marciano-Walcott (1952)---Municipal Stadium, Philadelphia

New York City was obviously vitally important as a boxing center.

As for the NBA, it was a non-legal body, so it had only the authority given to it by the states, many of whom rarely had boxing and never had major boxing matches. And the states could withdraw that authority anytime they wished, as Pennsylvania did in the case of Frazier, Texas in the case of Zyglowicz, and California in the case of Moore.

As for ratings, each only had the authority or influence that the public at large gave them. Ring Magazine had influence because the public valued their ratings above all others.

*one other thing, I think ratings can't just be conjured. They have to reflect the reality as the public sees it. If not, the public wouldn't grant them any respect.

 

I kind of thought so, as I don't remember seeing it much on newsstands, if at all.

In contrast, The Ring was available even in small town drugstores (and I know this from experience) throughout the United States when I was young.

The Police Gazette was the other major US boxing publication, although it was a general interest magazine, and boxing was only one of the sports within a wide range of subjects they covered.

 

"The NBA was boxing's ruling body at the time."

"I don't know why you are arguing this."

Because I think you are totally rewriting history. That first statement is just not true. It is like saying the United Nations is the world's governing body.

 

Yes. And the 10 highest grossing fights in boxing history have taken place in Nevada. And Nevada has a state athletic commission with government power.

But Nevada doesn't name champs, rank fighters or tell boxers who their mandatories are.

The NBA was the major sanctioning body when Marciano fought Charles.

New York wasn't. It was a state athletic commission. Ring wasn't. It was/is a magazine.

The NBA controlled professional boxing back then.

I'm not making this up. It was.

What in the hell is going on this week? :roll:atsch

 

HOW am I rewriting history?

The NBA was the ruling body in boxing back then. The WBC doesn't have any government authority today (neither does the WBA, the IBF, or the WBO), but it's one of the ruling bodies today of the sport.

Ring Magazine has never exerted any authority in boxing. It's a magazine. It has ratings. People might like the ratings. But that magazine's ratings had no bearing on who fought whom.

 

Whatever Nevada does today,

the New York State Athletic Commission did name champions and did vacate championships.

How did Joe Frazier originally win recognition as champion?

What about Ken Overlin, Ceferino Garcia, Billy Soose, Paul Pender, and Terry Downes?

Most of the time unification fights would take place,

and interestingly more often than today and more often than not there was only one recognized champion.

Of course the real champion is determined in the ring and the public, at least in the old days, considered the man who beat the man to be the champion. Most of the disputes were when a champion resigned his championship and there was no man who beat the man.

The NBA (now WBA) naming Ernie Terrell champion over Ali didn't make it anything more than a fiction for the public. Everyone knew who the real champion was.

Jimmy Ellis might have had a good theoretical legal case over Joe Frazier, but the public knew who was the better fighter from the get-go, and so Frazier was viewed as the real champ (except, of course, for Ali).

 

The Ring Magazine was highly influential in shaping public opinion, and public opinion ultimately weighs heavily on who fights who in boxing. If the public wouldn't support a match, it wouldn't be made.

The NBA was "a" ruling body, not "the" ruling body, and in fact had less power in my judgment than the NYSAC. And groups like the BBoC and EBU seem to have gone their own way. All named world champions at one time or another.

This might strike a lot of modern folks as a strange situation, but it was how things were.

But us old folks find several champions per division a strange situation also.

 

"The NBA was the major sanctioning body when Marciano fought Charles."

It would not have been recognized as a championship fight in New York unless the NYSAC recognized it as such. If the NBA did not recognize it as a championship fight, it would still have been a championship fight in New York.

As Marciano was obviously the champion, and Charles a former champion and at worst one of the top contenders, the public would have accepted it as a championship match.

The NBA had no real say in the matter.