Who Was the 3rd Best Heavyweight of the 1980s?

Holmes (should get Bill going ) Bill has always wanted him ranked in the top 3... his wish is my command.

 

When in shape, Greg Page.

 

JT, even watching it on live television, it was very obvious that Weaver was playing possum, and was timing The Truth in preparation for sending over his bomb of a hook, once he established the left-right-left-right rhythm of Carl's punching. Like so many others viewing it live, I knew that as soon as Williams delivered one of his lefts that Mike would strike back with his own left, and catch Williams coming right into it with another attempted cross. Hercules did not deliver that hook over Carl's low right, The Truth was in the process of shooting that right towards Weaver.

Bonecrusher Smith was mindful of how Weaver baited Williams when he applied due caution in finishing Hercules off after legitimately hurting him, and admitted as much in his post-fight interview. (This time though, it was obvious that Weaver was seriously stunned.)

Watch Weaver-Williams again. You'll be able to clearly discern that Mike is waiting to nail Carl between punches, and is able to because of the one-two predictabilty of the pattern. You will also clearly observe that The Truth's aggression is completely nullified by Mike's effective cover.

Then, watch Smith-Weaver. The difference between Mike's feigned distress and authentic distress should become readily apparent.

Mike was able to sucker Carl in because he was not known for baiting traps going into that contest. Beyond that, this was the victim of Joey Curtis. He'd be the last one expected to take such a risk. That's what made it a perfect trap.

I have only seen that match once, but my recall of it is pretty clear. The only one oblivious to what Mike was doing was Williams. Weaver neither wobbled or buckled. In fact, it wasn't a particularly good feint, but Carl got drawn into it anyways. (Kiddies, when you think you have somebody in trouble on the ropes, mix up your punches! Duran was a master of that. Double the hook or triple the jab, but don't fall into a predictable one-two pattern which your opponent can time.)

 

LOL. I rank Larry at 4.

 

I have to say i disagree and really don't think Weaver was THAT tricky or sublime. Remember that Weaver had been ko'ed by Pinklon Thomas in his fight right before this one and lost via KO1 right after it. My simple view is that Williams hurt Weaver and got defensively careless and overagressive in trying to finish him off. We could all see The Truth came in open and Weaver winged one at just the right time.

Sorry mate but i am going to have to totally discredit your whole debate on this one right here. I'm surprised an authority like you would get it so wrong actually.

Williams is in the process of throwing his own LEFT HAND, not right!

We'll call it a hook/uppercut hybrid with a leaning more toward an uppercut. His right hand is low enough for Weaver's left hook, thrown almost simultaneously, to land flush and hammer Williams to the canvas. Williams had actually dipped low to his own left then thrust his punch from there, which brings him up right into the path of Weaver huge hook. Williams own left flashes thru just in front of Weavers face as Weavers hook rams home a very very split second later. This is fact sorry.

So no Weaver didn't lure Williams into throwing a right cross he could counter at all mate. Just two big left hands thrown at the same time, with only one landing.

I think you are the one that needs to watch this again as per my points above sorry.

As i say, watch the fight again, closely.

Wrong, very very wrong. Do you have the match, if not we can try to get it up for you to see for yourself again.

 

Rocco is that you in your avatar?

 

In the 80s?

Seriously, Holmes was the best of all in his prime during the time he fought. Maybe he didn't get all the "Big Names" Ali got, but he beat what was available and some of them were pretty good.

Holmes is top 10 all time on any respectable ATG HW list.

 

Duo, just 8MB

http://www.megaupload.com/?d=4YJZ3NEI

 

I would favor Witherspoon slightly over Weaver, though I definitely understand your choice.It's funny, I thought I was the only one who thought Snipes won against Witherspoon.

 

Many thanks for the link JT! It brings back the excitement of watching it live all those years ago.:good

After closely reviewing it, I stand by my assertion that Mike was baiting a trap. His jaw was spun by a nice Williams right, but when he's laying back on the ropes, you see his right held up rigidly in a defensive position, while he's shielding the other side of his head behind a hunched left shoulder, as he cocks the hammer on his hook. Why was he keeping his left hand down by his waistline, instead of up around his head, like he was keeping his right? JT, the only logical conclusion is that he was preparing to nail The Truth with his hook, as he did.

Check out Weaver's defensive posture after he was knocked down by Dokes, when Joey Curtis robbed him of his title. Now, in that situation, Hercules actually was stunned, having been caught cold. In vivid contrast to his defensive posture against Williams, he's holding both his right and left tightly upside his head in peek-a-boo fashion. Have a look at Dokes-Weaver I, then please share what you think about the difference in the way Hercules was holding his left hand in both situations.

 

We'll have to agree to disagree about the trap, but i'm pleased ya enjoyed the clip. I'll look at the Dokes fight later tonight for sure. I don't doubt Mike had that left cocked waiting for a decent time to throw it, but again i'd hardly call it setting a trap. With Weaver's power and Williams chin Mike would have always considered himself a chance at any stage. After all he did coldcock Tate all the way down to the last seconds in the 15'th. I'd agree Weaver wasn't exactly reeling. I'll watch both again later.

 

Nice post.

 

I answered this thread 7 years ago and my answer is the same... Witherspoon = #3

 

Have to say I enjoyed this thread. '80s was before my time so if you look at history as a casual you have Larry Holmes the first half-decade, and then there's a muddle til Iron Mike takes out all comers.

 

Tim Witherspoon or Pinklon Thomas.