Who was the better heavyweight Tami Mauriello or Elmer a Ray?

So you agree Ray was better heavyweight than Mauriello. Good. We are in agreement.

I think Mauriello compares well to Lee Savold. Both decent contenders but not spectacular. Both had deep resumes, but no high quality wins. Savold much better longevity, Mauriello more consistency. Savold and Mauriello should be ranked side by side.

Ray well above both men


NBA did not have Mauriello rated as highly as the RING did. NBA rankings were much more accurate and unbiased compared to the New York RING who took care of their hometown kid.

Mauriello really wasn’t a heavyweight. This is another reason he had no chance to defeat a big powerful heavyweight like Ray. Mauriello started his career weighing 144, and soon fought at light heavyweight for the title. Mauriello looked like he had a midsection against Louis, he definitely could have still made 175

 

Louis was off 1.3 years from sept 1946 to dec 1947. Definitely have no issues with the Walcott defense, it was Louis best opponent. However, 1.3 years is a lot of time off. Louis could have squeezed in a great contender like Ray.

Louis should have fought BOTH


Sol Strauss, director of the Twentieth Century Sporting Club, made the announcement that the winner of the Charles-Ray fight would get a shot at Joe Louis and the heavyweight title. However, Strauss made the stipulation that there had to be a clear winner in their fight in order to be matched with Louis. Charles and Ray met on July 25, 1947, in Madison Square Garden. Throughout the fight, Charles was moving, boxing at long range and clinching when the action got too close or when he was hurt. Charles landed more often and seemed to land the cleaner blows. Ray remained the aggressor throughout the fight and landed the harder blows but not as often. Whenever Ray managed to hurt Charles with one of his destructive shots, he couldn’t follow up.

When the decision was made it was announced as a split decision for Ray. Again, Ray had landed the harder blows, but the Cincinnati Cobra’s strikes were more often and more accurate. The decision was controversial, with many in the crowd booing when the announcement was made. Some seemed to think Ray’s heavier blows and aggression won him the bout but it wasn’t the popular opinion. Ray won the decision, but the pain and frustration echoed from his voice afterward—he knew the fight would not grant him a title shot. “If Louis still refuses to meet me I’m gonna hang up my gloves. Why spend the rest of my life chasing him? Maybe I am a bum – so should a champ be afraid to keep his word and fight the winner of this bout?”

 

Ahhh so you have been trolling. you’ve had a bone to pick with me since you felt I “ratted” on Dago Wop

I’ve posted a ton of good info on Elmer Ray in this thread. It’s up to you if you wanna read it and educate yourself, or you could choose to just educate yourself on the golden boy from New York. And if you or Others don’t compare where I rank hiM on my lists, than how come this thread managed 13 pages with plenty of responses?

I will continue for the next 20 years to say Mauriello avoided top black men because in my opinion he did. so get used to it.

It seems you have an issue with myself claiming pre 1960 black heavyweight contenders often were given the shaft and had to take a back seat to inferior white contenders, and a lot of the white heavyweights were very coddled especially white New York heavyweights by managers, and they were taken care of in the ratings by RING Magazine. Case in point Mauriello and Lastarza. you’ve at least admitted mauriellos rating was too high. Then you went off on a tangent because you are upset I claimed Mauriello avoided black men. I believe lastarza did too.

Edward responded to you on this issue

"It's just stupidity."

Actually, the real stupidity is telling another person what his motivations are. What exactly is wrong with considering Ray better than Mauriello because Ray ended up beating better men who became champions?

 

Baksi was a typo, I meant a different fighter.

I do rate Baksi above Mauriello and do strongly praise Baksi for having the guts to take on Walcott and not hide behind he color line. But a case can be made Mauriello and Baksi were on the same tier

 

Yeah only 3 title defenses against black men. I believe Louis was the greatest heavyweight of all time and he’s my favorite fighter of all time, but that was a bad look for Louis. A lot of very talented black men he missed out on. In fairness, Louis did fight the 3 best black men of the era Walcott Charles Bivins and a really good 1930s fighter Roscoe Toles.

Louis went 4-1 against these men

 

Do you believe the term “black murderers row” even existed?

 

I actually don’t even know why you are arguing against me anymore

I’ve heard you say in this thread


1. Mauriellos rating was too high. We agree here

2. Ray was better than Mauriello at heavyweight. Again we agree here.

3. Mauriello belonged in tier 3 while Ray was in tier 1. Ok we agree here


You are upset I claim Mauriello avoided the top black men Ray Walcott Charles Thompson Murray toles And Bobo. But I feel he did.

 

Webbiano, good to hear from you my man.

After all the info that’s been posted about ray and Mauriello I ask you

1. Who was the heavyweight, Ray or Mauriello?

 

A lot to comment on. My response is going to have to wait until Monday. I’m going on vacation.

I will leave you with, Mauriello did duck Elmer Ray. I’ve posted the source. Now whether you want to believe he was afraid of Ray because of his reputation as a ferocious puncher or because of the color of his skin or both, that’s up to you.

Why is it after losing to Jimmy Bivins 2x, Mauriello never took on another rated black man for the next 5 years? He fought nearly all the rated white men from 1943-1946 often multiple times, but he missed out on Murray, Ray, Walcott, Thompson, etc?


Ultimately the question at hand is who was the better heavyweight ray or Mauriello. I think most on this forum would pick Ray.

 

Glad it’s been profitable for you.

What’s your conclusion who was the better heavyweight?

I wouldn’t talk about agendas Mcvey, we all know you have plenty of them when it comes to jack Johnson and jack Dempsey. I wouldn’t point the finger at other people.

But thank you for educating us about what “murderers row” is

 

Racial obsession? How many people still talk about Harry Wills? Is that racial obsession

Pre 1960, the black heavyweights got the shaft and you’ve admitted that. The white heavyweights were often well managed, coddled, and protected. Black heavyweights were not, and were often shunned from title shots.

I believe Elmer Ray was one of the 10 best heavyweight contenders in history to never fight for a world title

I believe Tami Mauriello was one of the worst number 1 contenders in history

Is ray was white, would he have gotten a title shot?

If Mauriello were not white and from New York does he ever make it to number 1?

It just so happens black men began receiving more title shots post 1960 and suddenly they’ve becoming dominating heavyweight boxing for decades. How many white heavyweight champions post 1960?