Who Was The Hardest Puncher Marciano Met?

I've already asked you about how a fighter would prove himself in the absolute top class (ie. how in fact fighters have done so), and you gave a vague answer that deferred to "broad consensus".

That's fair enough, but leaves me unsure if you have an independent personal opinion, or a set of criteria, too.

Which is okay, IF we can get others in on the discussion. :good

 

I think Ali is underrated as a puncher but I don't think he measures up to Moore.

Moore's filmed knockouts of Davidson and Johnson suggest he had a very heavy right hand that could put a guy out or change the fight. I know Ali dropped Liston but its all the subjective eye test. Moore's knockouts just look more powerful.

 

Effectiveness can only be measured by resume.

One punch power has to be measured by observation or reports. You can't claim a guy had one puncher when he never dropped or stopped anybody with one punch. And you can't deny a man didn't have one punch power when he knocked out guys with one punch.

Other stuff is more subjective. Like hitting "hard!" I think we can safely include Lyle hit hard because of the eye test or what have you, but ultimately he was not an effective knockout artist/puncher. Whatever you want to call it.

 

I do think one-punch KOs over good world class fighters are a good starting point.
Doing maximum damage with the minimum amount of punches has to be a VALID CRITERION for rating a puncher.

 

Of course, people will debate what counts as a "one punch KO" too.

I've seen it often objected to that Marciano knocked Walcott out in round 13, for example, and had landed damaging punches previously in the fight, so a degree of accumulation was a factor. That's a reasonable objection, to some extent.

 

I think Ali hit Lyle harder than Foreman did, but only once.
I think Lyle hit Foreman harder than Ali did, but probably not as much.
I think Foreman hit Frazier and Norton harder than Ali did though.

 

I agree with most of that.

But if enough quotes can be produced by his opponents that attest to Moore's power, then he's up there with Earnie Shavers, based on what you just wrote. He has a lot of KOs after all.

Moore and Lyle, I think, is debatable anyway. But I haven't studied Lyle for a while.

I believe Joe Louis trumps Archie Moore, with facts.

 

Well, I was talking visually impressive stoppages in this instance. On a pure statistical level, the Foreman and Bonavena KOs might be two of the best in history.

Know way to know to for sure who hit harder. Moore's punching power seemed to be just as effective as Lyle's, and being a superior fighter was able to knockout the better class of fighter.

 

The Louis heading to the Marciano fight wasn't as effective as Moore, but was his power truely dimiinshed or was his timing just off. Not to mentoin most of his opponents in his last run were a pretty cagey collection over a short period of time, almost as if Louis was intentionally trying get rounds in.

The Savold KO was impressive, he certainly still had a hard jab and left hook.

Their only common opponent in the 50s was the difficult Bivins. And Moore was the only man to stop him in the busy last third of his career.