Who were most loyal to their trainer/cornermen?

We usually do disagree --but I'm happy we do because you're shaping up to me my Ali -or Frazier- depending on your stance! You keep my powder dry.

That's some interesting evidence on Holyfield.... and it gives one pause. It also supports my argument more than yours, correct? Namely that Holyfield hit harder after 1993 when he may have started using.

As per Toney. The fact that he was a natural MW (with an undiagnosed but argue a clinical eating disorder) fighting HWs will obviously limit the advantage of steroids. Also, I'm not sure that he used them more than once for the Ruiz fight. Who knows.

Jones' hurt Ruiz early. But again, Jones tends to lay off. Had he had a killer instinct, who knows.

I have no proof because the whole thing is shrouded in mystery. And even if it wasn't there are a ton of intervening variables that are in the way -skill, size, of both guys, etc.

I think I may have seen clips of that on cable, but I will be sure to check it out at some point.

Thanks.