Discussion in 'World Boxing Forum' started by Dodgy Syrup, Jul 2, 2021.
No he cannot.
Ali = true GOAT with his IQ, fitness and determination and silky skills would be in the at least in semi final.
Foreman = brute strength no form has no chance in this field. Should even on this list. Holyfield dispatched him easy.
Frazier = smoking Joe, a happy left hooker cruiserweight who was a problem for Ali. Gets moshed by every fighter here.
Tyson = peak Tyson with no issues. Makes into the semi finals easy.
Lewis = good jab, great technique and engine but sporting a glass jaw. Glass jaw fails him on route to the semi finals.
Holyfield = would make it into semi finals but fails a drug test and is DQ.
Klitchko = one of the Klitschko's makes it into semi final.
Fury = provided he is in good mental condition, semi finalist.
Ali Vs Klitschko
Fury vs Tyson
You cant compare power and chin from a cruiser weight era to modern SHW's.
Ali's chin was very good but not Iron. Today it would just be average+ at best. The same goes for Foremans power. Good but not great.
Fair enough, mate.
Like your breakdown.
You really think the best version of George Foreman isn't better than 99% of post Ali heavyweights?
Who today would beat him, Fury aside?
This is the problem, isn't it, with the discrepancy in size between the modern super heavyweights and those from the 60s and earlier.
I mean, fighters like Joe Louis, Marciano etc...would, as you say, be cruiserweights.
That said, there is precedent for smaller guys competing at heavyweight.
Usyk, while admittedly unproven at the weight, is one - who outboxed a naturally bigger Chisora and is about to face a much bigger AJ.
Wilder was giving away 20-30 pounds to Fury and is much closer to the big cruiserweights than the big super heavies.
Holyfield was originally a cruiserweight, who moved up and did so in an era with guys like Tyson, Lewis etc...
There's also David Haye who had some success and was very small compared to some of the guys he fought.
Remember the bizarre spectacle of Haye v Valuev?
That's about as big an extreme as possible.
So, there are examples of small guys holding their own against the big guys.
I'm not saying this means it would happen in our fantasy match ups, but it can't immediately be discounted, right?
Depends entirely on the bracket. Match ups, etc. Good topic. Got me thinking.
I personally think George Foreman would have defeated most heavyweights in history except for Ali and Larry Holmes. I may be wrong but I think he takes even Bowe, Lewis and Holyfield all at their peak. Funnily enough the silky sublime skills of Tim Witherspoon Philly style might give him issues. He definitely gets to Pinklon Thomas. I think he get to Fury and unlike Wilder keeps him down and out.
I mean, I totally agree.
Timeout claimed Foreman shouldn't be on the list as he has nothing to offer and, apparently, would be dispatched by Holyfield with ease.
Personally, I felt that was unfair and asked him who beats George from any of the heavyweights of his era or among today's crop.
He hasn't responded yet.
I think that's a good point.
Who would reach the final would depend largely on who they face along the way.
Though, in this fantasy super series I've tended to do it as the fighters with the top 2 votes are in a final.
In the middleweight poll it was Hagler v Jones jnr, and if i remember rightly Roy just edged it.
So far, after 79 votes, we have a clear front runner in Lennox Lewis - with Muhammad Ali some way behind him but still way ahead of the third placed fighter Tyson Fury.
It looks like Ali v Lewis might end up the final at this rate.
Marciano if was 184-188 lber on scales with 0 dieting or water cut: today had been like Buatsi: modern LHW boxer.
Patterson too I suspect might had been like modern LHW ( 175 lbs ) boxer.
Bunches with old times HW boxers as CW with almost 0 problems etc.
One of the major reasons Ali is the Greatest of all time is because he stopped both Liston and Foreman 2 unbeaten viewed as unbeatable monsters nobody else could beat.
Brilliant thread. It’s a cliche but the old adage of styles make fights is never more true than in a conversation like this one. I think in a league format all would lose at least 2-3 fights. The format you’ve mentioned I’ve voted for Fury as I think he gives anyone outside of the SHW era nightmares and even then we’ve seen what he did to Wlad.
i’m tempted to go and actually put these in a hat and do the draw just for fun - depending how it goes it may help me consider my vote.
Lewis all the way