Who won if the Diaz/Condit fight kept going until someone was stopped?

Discussion in 'MMA Forum' started by Haggis McJackass, Feb 5, 2012.


  1. Haggis McJackass

    Haggis McJackass Semi-neutralist Overseer Full Member

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    For me, at the end of the 5th Diaz had slowed right down. His explosiveness was badly diminished, his workrate had dropped, he wasn't landing anything, and he was getting tagged easier and easier.

    Condit, on the other hand, was still moving easily, didn't appear gassed, and was starting to sit down on his strikes more.

    With the exception of the late takedown, Diaz really didn't appear to have a plan B.

    So what happens if there's a 5th round, a 6th round, a 7th round?

    Which of them gets worn down and eventually stopped?

    Discuss.

    :hat
     
  2. Will Cooling

    Will Cooling Boxing Addict Full Member

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    No offense but this an absolutely ******ed question. If it was a no-time limit fight it completely changes the context of the fight and the fighters will adjust their tactics accordingly.
     
  3. Haggis McJackass

    Haggis McJackass Semi-neutralist Overseer Full Member

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    Yes I considered this, obviously, and in most fights obviously it doesn't work at all. But in this fight it is far more applicable than most.

    What's Diaz going to do? Something other than stalk Condit and try to get in his face and break him down with volume punching and cardio?

    What's Condit going to do? Something other than avoid a toe-to-toe brawl or a submission battle, preferring to keep his range, take away Diaz's legs and pick him apart piece by piece?

    Condit was getting more aggressive as the fight went on. And Diaz always looks for the stoppage, just turns out he had no plan B.

    All the people who call Condit a coward for his performance, IMO Diaz was a lot further down the road of getting beaten up and stopped than Carlos was. :bart

    :hat
     
  4. Will Cooling

    Will Cooling Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Again its not the same. You can just go "how about five minutes". It changes the fight. Do you really think Greg Jackson would have sent Carlos Condit out to outlast Nick Diaz in an endless match? What sense do that make? Sure Diaz was getting frustrated but he wasn't getting beaten up. The closest either guy came to ending it was the last couple of minutes when Diaz had Condit's back.
     
  5. Haggis McJackass

    Haggis McJackass Semi-neutralist Overseer Full Member

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    For God's sake man, I know it's not realistic and not going to happen.

    If you want, you can just rephrase it as follows.

    Who was further down the road to getting worn down and stopped?

    IMO it was Diaz.

    Condit looked a lot fresher, was moving a lot easier, was landing cleaner, and was getting more aggressive.

    He wasn't holding out for the final bell at all. He looked like he could have happily continued to land on a more and more sluggish Diaz for another round, or two, or three.

    Diaz's face was all marked up - Condit's was fine.

    Diaz's legs were bruised and slow - Condit's movement was fine.

    Diaz's aggression was ineffective - Condit was landing whenever he chose to throw strikes.

    I KNOW that the fight plans would have changed if there was no round limit. OBVIOUSLY.

    I'm merely pointing out that Diaz was the one who was getting hit more. Diaz was the one whose workrate and explosiveness had slowed. Diaz was the one with the bruised and swollen face. And Condit was the one who was landing the harder strikes.

    Carlos was pulling away in the fight. Diaz always threatens with submissions, but Condit was great at neutralizing Diaz's offense. IMO, if that fight was allowed to keep going past its 5 round limit, it would have been Diaz who would have been worn down and stopped.

    :hat
     
  6. Will Cooling

    Will Cooling Boxing Addict Full Member

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    That would explain why Condit had to spend the last two minutes defending a submission from Diaz.
     
  7. Haggis McJackass

    Haggis McJackass Semi-neutralist Overseer Full Member

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    Yeah and he looked in big trouble didn't he. Diaz surprised Condit for the first time in the fight, got his back and couldn't do anything with it.

    Look, I have made the point very clear. It's very easy to see what I am saying. And it's legitimate - for someone who apparently is a coward and ran the whole night, Condit inflicted more damage and slowed Diaz down more than Diaz did anything to Condit. Personally, I see that pattern continuing, with Diaz getting less and less effective and Condit finding it easier and easier to land powerful strikes.

    If you don't think it's worthy of comment, then here's an idea. Don't comment. :good

    :hat
     
  8. Will Cooling

    Will Cooling Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Funnily enough you're misreading what I've written in my latter comments. Let me rewrite it again in bullet point form:

    1. Ignoring that this is stupid and meaningless

    2. Condit's gameplan while not as negative as Popkins made out was always likely to lead to a decision victory. He simply was not putting Diaz under enough sustained pressure to get the knockout.

    3. Diaz's original strategy had not worked. He had instead started going for takedowns. When he got it to the ground with just two minutes remaining he got a dominant position (back mount) and came very close to getting a submission.

    4. If the fight had continued the most likely outcome would have been a Nick Diaz submission victory as Condit's slight advantage on the feet would not prove telling no matter how long the fight was.
     
  9. Count Pacula

    Count Pacula Cashweight Thrillionaire Full Member

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    It could go either way. You can never really count Diaz out. He has unbelievable determination. If you put a gun to my head I'd choose Condit. I think he's smart enough to break down Diaz's pressure with body shots and eventually slip in a submission or a GNP stoppage.

    Condit is the better technician. Diaz is obviously the better brawler. It's a shame how people are discrediting Condit for his defense. I'd like to see Diaz stand and trade KICKS with Cung Le all day. See how that works out.

    Diaz as a pro boxer sounds good to me. Let's see how well he does against someone like Sergio Martinez or Abraham or maybe even Kirkland. Hell, I'd put my money on Pacquiao to stop Diaz. I can see it turning out like Pac-Margarito.
     
  10. elmaldito

    elmaldito Skillz Full Member

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    Condit. he wasnt tired and diaz couldnt do anything in the fight to score points.
     
  11. Will Cooling

    Will Cooling Boxing Addict Full Member

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    And if there's no end how is that relevant? :patsch
     
  12. achillesthegreat

    achillesthegreat FORTUNE FAVOURS THE BRAVE Full Member

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    Condit was breaking him down. The work Condit put in would have slowed down 99% of middleweights enough for him to go for the stoppage. You got to hand it to the Diaz brothers, they can take leg kicks. Most fighters legs would be completely ****ed after what Cerrone and Condit did to them.