Who's Greater: Juan Manuel Marquez or Oscar De La Hoya?

Discussion in 'World Boxing Forum' started by George Crowcroft, Nov 17, 2020.


Who's Greater?

  1. De La Hoya

    37 vote(s)
    74.0%

  2. Marquez

    13 vote(s)
    26.0%
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  1. CST80

    CST80 De Omnibus Dubitandum Staff Member

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    De la Hoya and it's not even debatable.
     
    CST80, Nov 17, 2020
    CST80, Nov 17, 2020
    #31
  2. Ph33rknot

    Ph33rknot Live as if you were to die tomorrow Full Member

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    Marques won his biggest fights de la hoya lost his
     
    Ph33rknot, Nov 17, 2020
    Ph33rknot, Nov 17, 2020
    #32
    Silver likes this.
  3. George Crowcroft

    George Crowcroft He Who Saw The Deep Full Member

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    I often use my own scorecards, which really works against Oscar here. I had Oscar winning the Mosley rematch, drawing with Tito, but losing to Sturm, Sweet Pea and Ike. I had JMM beating Pac 3-1, Norwood and John. If you compare the fights which I didn't mention though, it's not really close. For Marquez: Barrera, Casamayor, Diaz, Katsidis, Alvarado and Salido. De La Hoya: Chavez, Vargas, Carr, Gonzalez, Leija, Molina, Hernandez, Gatti, Campas and Mayorga.

    I can see the arguments for De La Hoya (and can definitely be persuaded to believe them, myself) but under my system of ranking, and how I scored their respective big fights, I thought Marquez ended up with better top 'wins'.
     
    George Crowcroft, Nov 17, 2020
    George Crowcroft, Nov 17, 2020
    #33
    Dannymita and Ph33rknot like this.
  4. George Crowcroft

    George Crowcroft He Who Saw The Deep Full Member

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    Just looking added up De La Hoya's record vs Ring rated fighters (top 10 in his division), and tbh, it's pretty underwhelming. Officially, it's 10-4. Here:

    Rafael Ruelas
    Julio Cesar Chavez
    Miguel Angel Gonzalez
    Pernell Whitaker
    Wilfredo Rivera
    Patrick Charpentier
    Oba Carr
    Ike Quartey
    Felix Trinidad (L)
    Shane Mosley 2x (L)
    Javier Castillejo
    Fernando Vargas
    Felix Sturm
    Bernard Hopkins (L)
     
    George Crowcroft, Nov 17, 2020
    George Crowcroft, Nov 17, 2020
    #34
  5. Ph33rknot

    Ph33rknot Live as if you were to die tomorrow Full Member

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    Pac is the greatest fighter just like duran beating srl
     
    Ph33rknot, Nov 18, 2020
    Ph33rknot, Nov 18, 2020
    #35
  6. Stiff Jab

    Stiff Jab Despiser of Super-Middleweights Full Member

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    ...I'm sorry, I'm just so floored that you said anything complimentary about Manny Pacquiao that I'm rendered speechless. I mean, it was in service to make Marquez look good, but baby-steps are an improvement. Proud of you.

    Also, while true (though some would argue Manny was beginning to decline by that point), Oscar had a better quality opposition across the board. Throw in his 'should have' victories over Mosley and Trinidad, plus greater boxing accomplishments, I don't see an argument for Marquez being 'greater' than Oscar.
     
    Stiff Jab, Nov 18, 2020
    Stiff Jab, Nov 18, 2020
    #36
    George Crowcroft likes this.
  7. Scrap_Iron_Johnson

    Scrap_Iron_Johnson Member Full Member

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    If you're going to throw in "should haves" there some be some "should have not". Oscar should have a loss to Whittaker and Felix Sturm. I still think Oscar is better overall, but I can't ignore giving him fights he "should" have one but ignoring his own robberies.
     
    Scrap_Iron_Johnson, Nov 18, 2020
    Scrap_Iron_Johnson, Nov 18, 2020
    #37
  8. JOKER

    JOKER Froat rike butterfry, sting rike MFER! banned Full Member

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    Nonsense. Pac had already been KO'd by Torrecampo and Singsurat and he lost to an old, shot, and drained Morales.

    ;)
     
    JOKER, Nov 18, 2020
    JOKER, Nov 18, 2020
    #38
    George Crowcroft likes this.
  9. Stiff Jab

    Stiff Jab Despiser of Super-Middleweights Full Member

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    Except I think he did beat Sturm and (past-it) Whittaker, so...
     
    Stiff Jab, Nov 18, 2020
    Stiff Jab, Nov 18, 2020
    #39
  10. George Crowcroft

    George Crowcroft He Who Saw The Deep Full Member

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    What about Ike?
     
    George Crowcroft, Nov 18, 2020
    George Crowcroft, Nov 18, 2020
    #40
  11. Babality

    Babality KTFO!!!!!!! Full Member

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    DLH.
     
    Babality, Nov 18, 2020
    Babality, Nov 18, 2020
    #41
  12. Stiff Jab

    Stiff Jab Despiser of Super-Middleweights Full Member

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    Oscar, but my opinion on that one changes every time I watch it.
     
    Stiff Jab, Nov 18, 2020
    Stiff Jab, Nov 18, 2020
    #42
    George Crowcroft likes this.
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