Who's more skilled: Ali or Usyk?

I loved the mad scramble trying to validate Sumo Ruiz when he axed body beautiful Joshua. All of a sudden he was the 250 pound modern improved version of Joe Louis, that no-one knew about.

 

And yet couldn't knock out Terrell or Bugner despite having all 4 as you say. He's not knocking out Usyk either

 

Terrell basically walked forward with his guard up, clinched and rabbit punched Ali… yet here he’s used to prove Ali could fight tall guys? oh and Bugner who is some okay guy he didn’t really show much against.

 

I like Andy. He's from Imperial, CA.

 

He wouldn't fair as well against anatomically modern heavyweights. Ali is a top dog in any era, durable, fast, fluid, can navigate the ring on another level to Louis with angles and incredible footspeed, already fought with modern gloves in the 60s and 70s. He is a much better version of Larry Donald

 

Funny how the people who bring up those fights never watched them

 

Sure Louis would, he could box small, knew how to inside fight properly and slip punches to shorten the distance and circle both ways… Ali boxed from the outside, only circled left towards the other guys right hand, tried to make you reach by pulling back (not rolling) a punch, and primarily pot shotted from the outside he didn’t know how to fight inside, he just clinched and yanked your neck… none of these things including dancing around getting on your front foot jabbing will work half as well against taller, bigger and stronger opponents… - another issue is how he got trapped so often in the corner by Norton a plodding type, he’d pull back at the head and feet to avoid punches even on reactions to feints… not a good habit vs a 6ft6 250lbs HW he fought at the end of a guys reach, issue is now he’d be the smaller guy.

 

They say something first, get called out, watch it and force themselves to see what they said.

 

Oh because clinching doesn't work ? Did Holyfield get destroyed in those clinches with Lewis ? Lol. Apparently fighting on the inside against much bigger men is now a good quality. This is the same guy that claims Frazier who is the best inside fighter in the 70s and objectively moves his head and blocks more than Joe Louis would get destroyed against modern heavyweights. Frazier would wipe his ass with the stiff mechanical 1930s super heavyweights that's for sure

Ali could circle both ways that is nonesense.

Ali could cut the ring against a fleet footed Bugner, had the reflexes to step back while leaning back to avoid straight punches and long jabs and yes, he rolled with punches all the time, mostly right hands, and when he pulled back he usually turned his head to take the sting out the punches, not to mention he slipped to the side plenty against Liston. He had a faster jab than louis, jabbed while in motion unlike Louis who jab while grounded, could counter over the jab and drop guys going backwards like Mildenberger and Liston. Moved in and out, feints a lot more than Louis, had a severaly underrated check hook, superior upper body movement, footwork and faster feet which gave him more angles and routes away from the power shots. The constant movement alone is a problem. Ali would dictate the battle of the jabs and make these lumps chase after him before picking them apart

 

Mostly an air sandwich here, everything I said holds true if you’re objective. Inside fighting is exactly how you can negate the size advantage, Frazier just wasn’t on Louis’s level overall as a boxer, inside fighting isn’t the issue for JF. You don’t even know what “rolling” a right is based on what you’re writing about Ali there no offence lol, can you show me Ali circling right in a fight? In a useful way, in a fighting sense not just running laterally to his right but actually circling and fighting going that way, he dropped Liston with a pivot to his right, that’s all I can remember and it was a once off, rare af occurrence lol.

 

Far from it.

 

Thats not the only way to negate size and reach lmao are you this dense ? Chisoras pressure couldn't do anything with Fury but gave Usyk a hard time, it's all situational and how the opponent approaches. Louis is a skilled stiff who fought other stiffs in prehistoric gloves, he does not do better in the modern eras. The heavyweights back then were literally smaller than the 70s give or take a few super heavyweights and they couldn't dominate because size is overrated

Were you not referring to turning your head to take the force out of a punch ? Ali usually turned his head when he pulled back but he could also roll with punches, just not as frequently. He literally circled both ways against Mildenberger and dropped him going backwards

 

Could you show me Ali fighting going right? - I didn’t say it was the only way, I made how you negate size pretty clear for Louis in a rough sort of way… I’ll say again what he could do, fight short, you close the distance with your feet slipping shots properly and not fighting on the outside of someone’s reach like Ali, you circle right to put you outside the left shoulder and create a huge distance between you and the right hand to roll the right, make him reach and counter - Louis actually would probably take a similar but less dynamic approach to Tyson (get in and light them up) or what Schemling did to himself in some respects… about rolling shots (no it’s not rolling with a shot by turning your head…) look at what Toney did to make guys reach, you shift your weight on the rear foot, look what Louis did to Schemlings right (he’d put his glove up and roll the right to counter with an uppercut… Bowe did it to Holyfield) also don’t like you calling me dense we be cool MF…

 

The fact that your asking me to provide you with a video of Ali circling to his right.... do you even watch this guy ?

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Louis is a great combination puncher but doesn't have Tysons speed, angles, head movement or his chin. Not even sure he hits as hard.

I keep telling you how Ali can take away a bigger guys size, reach and not let them set their feet but you just chuck it because you don't wanna envision Ali outmaneuvering and blitzing slower lumps, which is exactly what would happen. Fury could barely handle Cunningham ffs... Fury admitted the mobility and slickness was troubling, we don't need to bring up Usyk. Ali isn't just fighting out of someone's reach which is why you're so confused, he doesn't just jab and move to his left, his only defense isn't pulling back like you claim it is. Ali can't slip to the side, pivot, step back, move his feet while leaning back ? Are you serious ?

 

I still don’t see Ali fighting going to his right that’s circling properly off a small pivot… running the track lateral, stepping that way for a punch against a southpaw a bit but that’s not the same thing… again show me, orthodox fighter preferably.