Who's physically stronger in their prime: Muhammad Ali or Mike Tyson?

Fair calls mate.

 

If Tokyo Douglas landed everything he did to knock down Tyson on Ali, would Ali have stayed standing as long...without any of his famed pulling back/movement, like if he took the shots just like Tyson, I think he would have gone down easier than Tyson

 

Any version of Ali wouldn't have taken all those consecutive shots, but if he did he would have dealt with them better than Tyson. Ali's punch resistance and recuperative powers where greater than Tyson's.

 

Any version? Including the version dropped heavily by cruiserweight cooper an saved by the bell? What about the one brutalised by Holmes?

you did say any version didn’t you?

 

Yes, and I stand by what I said. Ali got up against Cooper and was never knocked down by Holmes, Norton, Foreman, and Shavers. Ali ate a left hook by absolute prime insanely motivated Frazier and got back up.

 

You think Buster would have knocked out Muhammed Ali?

 

Tyson, as far as I know, only started doing exercises with weights in his "second career". Well, let's say that Tyson was physically stronger in terms of bench press.
And who would win in arm wrestling, I certainly can't tell you, and I doubt that anyone can. Arm wrestling has a lot more technique than it seems at first glance.

 

Tyson's lower body was made of tree trunks. He was a stocky fighter, 4 inches shorter than Ali but weighed 10 lbs more, all muscle.

How people can say Ali is beyond the realms of understanding.

 

People misconceive tyson as weak because holyfield pushed him back. 1 holyfield was freakishly strong, he pushed almost everyone back in clinches. Sometimes straight up shoved them.
2. It had alot to do with leverage and Tysons declining footwork, balance. Squaring up. Which allows someone with a side on stance to push him on his heels.
Im sure nobody believes Buster mathis was stronger than Tyson because he backed him up too? Kept him against the ropes for some time actually.

Ali was strong as hell too though.

 

Tyson probably had the stronger upper body. He did lots of pushups, dips, sit ups, etc, and even dabbled in weights in the 90's. Ali did old school training and avoided weights, although he did train with the medicine ball and chopped wood. If they competed to see who could bench press more on the spot without getting time to actually train, I would say Tyson since that is more about raw chest and arm strength.

In terms of leverage and functional strength in the clinch, Ali would absolutely clown Tyson. He managed to grapple and control all the big strong heavies of his era and many opponents gave him his props. In contrast, there are several fighters who had a relatively easy time handling Tyson in the clinch, most notably Smith, Bruno, Holyfield, etc. Part of this wasn't just Tyson's smaller size, it's the fact Cus didn't really emphasize actual inside ability and clinching during training so it was mostly a complete lack of fundamentals in that area on Tyson's part.

If they wrestled on the matt no holds barred, I would say Tyson looks very explosive for the first few minutes, but if he didn't submit or pin Ali, he'd gas out and Ali would drown him late. Ali had way more endurance and had that wiry strength. I suspect if both guys learned karate or muy Thai, Ali would have much more powerful kicks given how much intense running, jumping rope, and bouncing on the toes Ali did developing springy legs like a gazelle.

 

Ali manhandled a prime Foreman and made him his ***** through strength and resilience. Show me a Tyson victory like that.

 

The reason Holyfield pushed him around was probably because of how square on Tyson stood. It’s easy to push someone back if they stand with there feet not far from side by side.

 

The OP was specific about the type of strength (approximating to sheer strength) he was talking about - though arm wrestling does involve plenty of technique.

We can certainly compare their applied strength in the ring - imo, Ali clearly takes the honours in that regard.

As to bench pressing and other weight lifting - on appearances, I might choose Mike due to his greater muscularity in appearance - but besides that, there appears to be little else to go by.

Does Tyson even have any bench press claims out there and how official and/or well corroborated are they? To repeat, Ali had greater height and longer limbs to better apply his strength functionally in the ring.

Or, should I say, Ali’s physical dimensions for one thing, let alone technique, allowed him to better utilise his raw strength - even if that raw strength was < than Tyson’s.

 

It's a real flaw in Mike's use of the Fitz shift. He falls in square and doesn't truly shift stance if the distance or angle isn't right, stands square in the clinch and stands square as the ref breaks up the clinch.

Evan absolutely took advantage of that - Mike even drops his hands, square stance and is right there to be hit just after a clinch. Crazy!

 

Ali "manhandled" Foreman? Ok. And Ali was exhausted at the end.

Facing opponents bigger than Foreman on a consistent basis, was Tyson ever manhandled himself? Tyson didn't need to manhandle anyone like the way you're describing Ali-Foreman.

Different fighter, different strengths. Tyson was built like a tank.