Who's the greatest welterweight you'd favour pacman over?

I hope Marquez will win though. he's been given the short stick too many times

 

I want Pac to win in style!

But I'll always recognise the credit Marquez should get for his performances in the two previous fights regardless of this weekends action.

 

If Pac loses then no Pacquiao-Floyd. **** that ****.

 

Well, maybe. A much better chance though, I think. My hopes are high luf, quit trying to drag me down.

 

It may shock you, but I want a crushing Pacquiao victory and for the calls for Pacquiao-Mayweather to intensify tenfold on that basis.

 

Is he much bigger? Pac weighed in 145 on fight night for the Marquez rematch, in 2008, for their 130-pound fight. He weighed in on fight night for Margarito in 2010, for their 150-pound limit, a total of 148 pounds. That's three pounds bigger. Contrast that with JMM being 141 for the Pac rematch, and 145 for his Katsidis outing. There is still about the same disparity, except neither man should have to take off more than five pounds of water to make their designated limit.

The difference here should be that one man's much fresher. Pac's gotten better, JMM's faded. He's still damn good, but he's not what he was. Pac should win but not because of weight-because the disparity will be about the same, in all likelihood. Pacquiao hasn't exactly done a Pazienza here, no matter what goofy **** about force-feeding him is being spouted. Just because his opponents are growing doesn't mean he is, too.

I love how he was coming in 145 on fight night at 130, where he was exerting himself to make weight, then for 135 he comes in two pounds heavier at 147 and then he comes in for 140 a single pound heavier than that at 148, then up at 150, same weight and people act like "Whoa, he's bulked up so much. When's it gonna stop? Steroids! Steroids!"

The fight-night weigh-ins are not their actual weights. Pac's weigh-in limit has gone from 130-150 but his actual fight-night weigh-in has gone from 145-148 (with one blip at 150, for Clottey, I think, and he apparently told Ariza he didn't like that and felt slower, and came back down those two pounds).

So, it's not that Pac is proven fighting 20 pounds heavier himself and Marquez is proven fighting 5 pounds heavier. They're still a few pounds apart on their last released TOTT's and will likely be in their upcoming bout, barring JMM and co don't pay the slightest attention to their actual publicly released opponent's weights and are thinking 'Well, if he's a welter, we've gotta be a good 150-155 pounds'. Pac's only proven he can kick the **** out of much bigger guys, where Marquez hasn't. They, however, are about the same size, despite their last opponents opponents or the weigh-in limits for them.

 

I thought he was 144 against JMM and I didn't know there was a fight night weight for Margarito, did HBO do 1? Regardless a 144lb man will be much stronger having not drained himself down to 130lbs the previous day, especially if they weren't taking the weight off properly. So yes Manny is going to be stronger at WW and maintained his speed at the weight, how will Marquez carry the weight? Will he be as fast/mobile? Will he gain strength? It remains to be seen

 

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It was much talked about, by the forum and on the pre and post shows for that match, also. That Pac didn't even try getting max weight, he wanted to maintain his speed and went against Ariza's wishes to make him a few pounds heavier for a guy that was likely to come in so big and I am also pretty sure we have had this exact same discussion before. I think it was in the general forum, so you must have blocked it out with numerous other horrific memories of your trip there.

Indeed, that explains why Marquez, not having to drain will be much stronger, also? :yep And, yes, Manny has shockingly maintained his speed at three pounds heavier than he was for Marquez, or seems to have, against bigger, bulkier opposition.

What weight will he be carrying? Do you think he will be more than he was for Katsidis by some significant amount? :think Will he outweigh Pazienziao even? :shock: He's not particularly fast or particularly mobile anymore, anyway. And he's adjusted his style with that understanding, it seems, and worked it pretty well, for the most part. He's lost quite a bit in his legs and his hand speed has diminished. So, that's not going to be much different, I don't think. If he puts on a couple pounds and slows down though, I assume the same winner either way. But, I hope he has some surprises up his sleeve and gives a good account of himself.

 

Fair play, it seems odd with the force feeding that he isn't gaining weight, he must run it off. Yes I do remember discussing this before, although a little drink makes the memory hazy indeed

The thing is as mentioned Marquez has tried to bulk up for WW, as he did against Mayweather, this time he's looking to maintain his speed/mobility. He really needs to be at his quickest against Pacman in order to evade and counter

Yes Marquez is likely stronger without draining but I don't think he has any problems making LW, Pacman obviously would though. I think Pacquaio may have been quite drained in the JMM rematch if you look at his cheekbones, that's a sign of being drained. He has a lower bodyfat than Marquez, which makes cutting water a bit harder to do to get down to those lower weights

Marquez is looking very good physically, not that that means allot, but he's certainly bulked up. How will that affect him? What about the rumours of PEDs in JMMs camp? We really don't know how this will all affect Marquez but we'll see on Saturday (Sunday morning for me)

 

Boxed Ears

 

Green: That must be what they mean by all the protein shakes and calories. Frankly, I've never taken that talk too seriously,

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from their camp.

White: It does help, when reading the general forum. Me too. :deal

Green x2: Yeah, now he came in pretty light for the first Diaz match, almost the same as the Pac fight at 130, I think, but once he came back down for Mayweather, he wasn't losing some of that and, apparently he didn't have to. The thing for me is, he wasn't really matching speed with Pacquiao before, and he ain't doing it now either, regardless. He wasn't matching speed with Diaz, honestly. He is more about timing. He still has good timing.

White x2: Defnitely, Pac was drained at 130, and I don't doubt it. It's part of why I don't put much stock into this forcefeeding talk, when he's struggling to stay UP at a weight three pounds heavier than he was when he was training down as much as possible? :? Hard to believe, for me.

I'd say Pac could make lightweight, at a stretch, but he's more of a light welterweight that doesn't have the need or want to make 140, and it wouldn't be to his advantage in his career in general anyway. He and Bradley are about the same size and neither are big at light welter, at that. Yeah, their body types are different, for sure. Pac is naturally bigger with less body fat, agree. JMM is much more top heavy, to me, also, which doesn't help him going up against larger framed men.

Green x3: When there's a 24/7 in camp rumours and controversy seem to always be around. :think Interesting. Pac isn't training properly because of politics and fans, Margo and Rios mocked Roach, this guy's wraps, that guy's PED's, is Mayweather too distracted by the law? Can Hatton adapt to the Kool-Aid? Is Joy's cough worse? Does Boza know the difference between fish and a sandwich? Does Ortiz have roots or isn't he that kind of tree? Can you sanction a fight with a tree? atsch I give up, with these guys.