Why 87 Tyson beats 66 Ali...

Actually when you look at the Ali-Liston 1 this is what happened to Liston,who had a very solid chin.
What's forgotten in that fight was that Liston was busted up.

 

And Liston is so Tyson-esque with his spectacular head motion...

 

I wasn't saying they were similar. All I was saying was that although Liston had a great chin he was uncomfortable being constantly peppered by Ali's jabs and combinations which busted him up.
When big punchers like Cleveland Williams exploded bombs off his jaw and he shrugged them off.
Anyway Tyson's head movement was less pronounced the longer a fight went.

 

People are wont to say that Tyson had bad stamina. I don't think so; he was trained to a hair in his prime, and mostly well after it.

However, I think his style required incredible focus and concentration. He was a 'little' guy fighting in a big man's era. I think if Tyson became less effective as the rounds wore on, it was mainly because he lost intensity and a bit of focus.
If you look at the end of the Tucker fight for example, he isn't even breathing hard. I very rarely saw (if ever, actually) Mike sucking in big mouthfuls of air.

 

Ali wins

 

Tyson's peek a boo style requires good reflexes and coordination to be optimally effective. While Mike was quick with his head movement and certainly was coordinated, it may not be enough against Ali's very fast hands and feet and constant peppering of punches. Against an average HW in terms of speed, Tyson could be very discouraging as he could slip a blow and land his own punishing shots. None of Mike's opponents however were as fast as a prime Ali was in both hands and feet. I see Tyson slipping a few shots but not being able to make Ali pay due to Ali's speed of foot and uncanny reflexes. I think Mike may get frustrated and start to lunge at Ali to try to put some hurt on him, all the while being countered with fast combos...and verbal taunts as well. Mike had a good chin so Ali may not stop him but I think he would probably outbox him. Ali by dec.

 

If both fighters in their prime were to fight each other tomorrow, how many of you would be confident in picking Ali to win? I wouldn't. In fact, if I were a betting man and forced to pick a winner I would place money on Tyson. Helluva match up with both men able to exploit the other's weaknesses. But Tyson feasted on this style as a boy, young man, amateur and in the pro ranks. If anyone can get to a prime Ali and come out the victor I'd pick Mike Tyson to do it.

 

I would be very confident Ali would win. Aside from ability Ali had true all time great attributes in his will to win, mental toughness and durability. Ali would pre cc ail as rounds went by as Tyson would become discouraged and show his greatest defect ss a fighter....his mentality.

 

This wasn't evident until the Holyfield rematch after getting headbutted to death, also a good 8/9 years after his prime. You don't become undisputed world champ at the age of 21 and completely obliterate the division by being mentally weak. All that talk is nonsense.

 

I would be confident in picking Ali. Its a dangerous fight. Tyson may have beaten some Ali imitators but there was really only one Muhammad Ali. Still haven`t seen a heavyweight to this day with his speed and coordination. Not to mention all the other attributes he brought to the table.


At some point when Ali takes Tyson into deep water it really has nothing to do with boxing. Everything to do with heart, desire, mental toughness as well as conditioning and stamina.

My $ would go on Ali everytime.

 

You could well be saying the same about Tyson.

 

Well put. This is the heart of the matter. This is the difference in this fight. Provided Tyson doesn't make it count before the deep waters come...

 

No dispute Tyson did have great ability.

The reason I couldn`t pick Mike Tyson with any confidence is because as the division started to heat up and get tougher with fighters like Bowe, Holyfield and Lewis, Moorer, Foreman etc he was already on the decline.

I never really saw Tyson did deep and comeback in a fight. At the elite level I think that`s a huge redflag.

 

Ali was just plain better than Tyson in almost every department apart from power. A peak Ali was just the supreme athlete and would have always found a way to dismantle any version of Tyson. A clue to how he would have fared with his peek a boo style was the Patterson fight and even though Tyson was a harder puncher he would have to gotten close to Ali to do any damage, easier said and done with the movement and ability to dodge a punch that Ali possessed. The only chance that Tyson would have had was an early knockout as soon as he was extended into the latter half of a fight he would have had no chance to outpoint Ali and would probably have been knocked out.

 

First he did not become true champion until he beat Spinks.

Secondly Tyson was what he always was. In a tough fight where he has to think and is being beaten on he falls apart. He was that way as an amateur and he was that way later in his career. Issues with will to win don't just go way it's just no one was good enough to bring them to the fore.

Alis style, reflexes, ripping punches and his far greater will to win would lead to a tko victory prior to round 10.