Why are people still saying Bute got KO'd against Andrade?

I voted "no" but stand by considering it a mere technical "no".

In a fair world, Wright would have done his job properly and Bute would have been knocked out. As it is...no it isn't Bute's fault that Wright ****ed up. Bute should not be held accountable for those mistakes and the W on his record should stand because those are the rules in boxing (referee's word is final).

However, it is appropriate to criticize Wright in his capacity as an official and to point to this particular incident as one in a long series that prove his incompetence. :deal

 

So IB, you're saying the timekeeper did his job correctly?

http://www.eastsideboxing.com/news.php?p=17659&more=1

Pasky's post also highlights the fact Bute was KD with 4 seconds left in the fight.

 

How many seconds elapsed between Bute hitting the canvas and being on his feet unsupported by the ropes? :think

Longer than 10 second, by my count.

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Down (contact with canvas) at 0:58.

Grabs rope to steady himself to rise at 1:02.

Starts rising at 1:05/1:06.

Flops back into ropes at 1:07 and bounces off.

Collapses atop adjacent ropes at 1:08 and remains flopped on them until at least 1:11 that we can see. (in fact, he remains slumped with his back propped up against the ropes/corner for most of the duration of the video...it isn't until 1:25, after the fight is officially over that he is fully standing of his own cognizance supporting his own weight on his own two feet).

That's thirteen seconds. You need to be up at the count of ten (granted, the referee's count of ten...not the official clock's or real-world count of ten). Not "wobbling from one set of the ropes to the next to hold yourself up". Being held up by just the ropes is considered "down". If a fighter is hit and then held up by just the ropes, a 10 count (not a standing 8; a 10 count) can be applied even though the canvas hasn't been touched.

So again - had Wright done his job and been counting from 0:58 onward (even allowing for a slightly slow count) - Bute would have been KOed as he would not have been up and able to put his gloves out to the referee and come forward per instructions by the count of ten (as he did not have his legs and was still pinballing in the corner after thirteen seconds). You can't be saved by the bell in any round, including the 12th and final round. Had Wright been focusing on counting from 0:58 onward...unless he applied a VERY slow count...Bute would have to have been ruled knocked out.

As it is, Wright incorrectly finished the 10 count with Bute leaning back against the ropes...which is not allowed.

 

Bute KO4 Andrade! There is no controversey. It's over.

 

That's interesting that they word it as such. :think

So then why the ritual of having the fighter get fully erect (no homo) and then holding his gloves out for the referee to shake and then taking a step toward the referee in most other championship bouts where this situation arises?

Many fighters have been waved off and/or counted out once their "hands clear the floor" but prior to completion of the above rituals.

 

wrong. A good referee follows the rules, which is what Marlon Wright did.

And secondly, even without the longer count, Bute got up within 10 seconds, and was down with less than 10 seconds to go.


it's pretty simple, but I realise some hard concepts to grasp for many of the people on this forum

 

:think Fair enough.

Like I said, given the rules the win is a valid one...and Bute certainly shouldn't be copping any hate for how it went down. Besides, he more than proved who the stronger man was in the rematch. :deal

 

Didn't Kenny Bayless give Ricky Hatton some extra time to recover because PAcquiao was stepping out of the neutral corner?

That rule is as basic as can be.

how pathetic is it that a ref who follows the rules will get criticized if those rules favour the hometown fighter.

Maybe a ref should always act to the detriment of the hometown fighter, regardless of the rules, just so dumbass boxing fans don't slag him off.

 

bute got up before the 10 count (even before 10 secs).

but was in no state to continue, but i figure at the end of round 12 - if you get up on your own steam the ref should not stop it.

 

That's not a mandatory thing IB. It's just a technique that most referess use to assess if a fighter can continue fighting...

BUT and it's a HUGE BUT.... after time has elapsed at the end of the 12th round, a fighter doesn't need to prove he can continue fighting, as long as he's up before the REAL COUNT of 10 REAL SECONDS....never mind what Marlon Wright did....with his 20 + seconds...

On this last point I 'm not 100% sure...but I think amongst the main orgs (WBA - WBC - IBF - WBO), only the WBA forces a boxer to prove he can continue fighting after time elapsed in the 12th round, if he went down and got up before the count 10 real seconds...