He'd lost 2 in a row, but to great, great fighters. At 32 he wasn't ancient and could easily have continued against mid-range contenders even if he considered his title-fighting days over. Has anyone read Joe's take on this? I guess he just thought he wasn't a champ any more and it was time to call it quits, but wondering if anyone has insights on it. Incidentally, probably a good call on his part. I know he had the comeback fight and abandoned that quickly, but he does seem to be a case of someone that knew when to pack it in.
It was time. He'd nearly died after the first Ali fight, (and personally I don't think, from what I've seen, that he had regained much of his form from Ali-Frazier I until Manila) Frazier had a wealth of physical problems including a cataract in one eye, high blood pressure, arthritis, etc. After his first lost to foreman, he fought 4 times in the next 2 and a half years, beating Bugner and two guys he'd already beaten before in Quarry and Ellis, (and Ellis at least majorly on the downside by that point) while losing in Ali-Frazier II. Then comes another loss at the hands of Ali in a hugely damaging fight and another pasting from Foreman. It was time, and Frazier was done at that point. He was done physically, he still had a warrior's heart but not the ability to use it like he used to, and I just don't think Frazier had any taste for hanging around and facing all the also rans and fringe contenders in the Heavyweight ranks if he didn't have a realistic chance of being champ.
Partly the same reason Marciano retired at a nearly identical age. The style is unbelievably demanding, both mentally and physically. If that fire dims one bit you're in trouble. Try crouching over and fighting like Marciano and Frazier. It kills your back, Marciano himself had terrible back problems because of it as his career came to an end.
Thanks, I didn't realize he was so broken down at that point. I know his hasn't been the best of post-boxing stories but it could certainly have been a lot worse.
And the guy is definitely punchy today; you can tell that he's an ex-fighter by the way he talks. He probably should have quit right after the first Ali fight; he would have saved a lot of brain cells and would have avoided the blow-outs to Foreman, which probably dropped him down a notch in the all-time rankings....
Frazier had a lot of injuries and health (back) problems. You could say it's a miracle he was able to give Ali two such tough fights in the first place, in 1974 and 1975. I think he talked about retiring as early as in 1971.
Durham and Futch wanted Joe to retire immediately after the FOTC. Frazier kept putting off cataract surgery on top of his hypertension and arthritic problems. Interestingly enough, Ali's greatness can be defined in how his primary opponents faired after fighting him. Liston was never the same, Frazier never the same, Norton never the same, Foreman never the same and even Spinks was never the same. Frazier left almost everything in the ring against Ali in 1971. I have yet to see another heavyweight fighter let alone another boxer showcase the pressure and pace of a prime Joe Frazier. Tua, Tyson and Holyfield, who were somewhat pressure fighters don't even come close to Frazier in his prime. All this talk about Frazier being a slow starter only makes sense when comparing his speed to a prime Ali.
Floyd Cummings let him know that he couldn't hang in decent company any more, Joe had fought a few wars in his career too... It definitely was time..
After losing to Foreman in 1976, Frazier had accomplished as much as he could expect in boxing. There was no possibility of getting a fourth Ali fight or a third Foreman fight, so Joe's path to the championship seemed permanently blocked. Aside from this, after 12 years of pro boxing, Frazier's physical abilities were eroding. Financially, Frazier was set for life because his millions in earnings were invested in trust funds. All things considered, it seemed reasonable for Frazier to call it quits and enjoy his legacy as an all-time great heavyweight champion.
