Why does size matter?

that's what these guys do evade and use the worst big Heavy oversized guy to prove weight and size is irrelevant. lol

 

You would be wrong , knock out percentages went down for the sub 200 pound fighter as fighters on average started weighing more,thats why the cruiser weight division was created. where do you think as gloves got bigger which was about the late 80's really that,size wasn't the factor ?

 

I didn't evade that question actually. He asked would I rather be punched with 6oz gloves from Joshua or 10oz, I said he'd put me in hospital with both.

 

You have evidence of this? That the world bodies decided "knock out percentages went down for the sub 200 pound fighter" as fighters on average started weighing more?

I think the cruiserweight division is partly to blame for the oversized fighters in that fighters don't want to be in it! Now it's reached the point where HW is so big only the tallest giants can functionally carry that much weight even with all the advances in strength nutritionists.

That's why I think Only a call to change the name of cruiser to heavyweight (Now that a hydrated cruiser can be 220 anyway) to come in line with amateur boxing can save the sport.

 

To save boxing we need competitive match making like they have in UFC.

 

Sure just look up why the cruiser weight division was created in the 80's . Statistically all k.o percentages go down with any fighter the heavier weight class they move up or opposition they fight,do you think thats a coincidence ? Name a power puncher and i'll give you an example ? Its common sense heavier guys will have the advantage over lighter guys usually . The heavier guy will also usually beat the taller guy ,thats why they didnt make height classes.

This paragraph is absurd , because you are blaming 6'4 230 plus guys the average HW today as the reason smaller guys aren't boxing? lol

"I think the cruiserweight division is partly to blame for the oversized fighters in that fighters don't want to be in it! Now it's reached the point where HW is so big only the tallest giants can functionally carry that much weight even with all the advances in strength nutritionists. "

The truth is if 200/210 guys could dominate they would be doing it right now . The real answer you don't want to hear is the HW division needs to be at 225 and over ,being only 1 to 5 % below 220 is even ranked .

 

Nah ,when fronted with given examples of why size don't matter ,you throw the past time era big guys names in then use the worst big guys of the modern era losing to smaller ones as evidence that it somehow the rule of thumb . This is called b.s . lol

Just because you have smaller guys winning doesn't mean or show proof size doesn't matter thats ridiculous ,when most dominant era champions barring Tyson had the size advantage more than not .Louis wouldn't be a HW IF he were at his same dimensions he fought at but was a big in HIS day ,he would HAVE to add mass to greater his chances .....that would mean SIZE to adjust to the MORE skilled big men had he fought in a post 60's era .

If you guys theory were solid that means say , Louis at 190 /200 pounds defeats Lewis 240/250 pounds and top guys of the Louis era Galento, Conn and Sharky's all are on Lewis 's level which would also be equally ridiculous .

Louis top 3 opponents rounded off weight at fight period
M.Baer 210
Shmelling190
Braddock 195

Lewis top 3 opponents rounded off weight at fight period
Holyfield 215
Tyson 235
Klitchko 250

If you switched opposition and put them AS is in the others era who do you think opponents fare better ? the MUCH bigger ones of the 90's/2000 or the smaller1930's 1940's ? Still think size doesn't matter ? I could throw 3 average size 90's guys with good skills and they would still run rampant in a smaller 190 /200 pound average weight era .Im not even adding skills bc then its another added strike

Tommy Morrison 6'2 225
Ray Mercer 6'1 225
Oliver McCall 6'2 230

How difficult would any guy under 215 have with them in a 40's era ?

How about 260 Foreman vs 175 Conn ? who do you like in that one? lol

 

I agree the SHW is here. They are the only guys tall enough to carry enough weight to get out of the cruiserweight division and still be functional.

You have to be above 220 to get out of CW now.

The greatest 96% of heavyweights in history are within the hydrated cruiserweight class seeing as a so called "cruiser" can be as high as 220 in the ring. That's a heavyweight.

In the Amatuers cruiserweight is called Heavyweight. It should be called Heavyweight in the pros too. Not cruiserweight.

Consider this, what if Dempsey wore 10oz gloves against Willard rather than 6oz gloves? He nearly punched himself out as it was after three rounds! Even if he hit as hard, it would be a different fight. Bigger gloves don't make it easier to land on target.

Now we have a situation where Dempsey needs to be heavier to get out of a weight class nobody wants to be in, closer to the weight that only a taller man can carry. He also has to carry excess weight then wear gloves that don't make it easier to land on target.

This all has to be considered.

 

Smaller gloves cause more damage , bigger gloves hit a wider radius and dont need as much accuracy .Punching with bigger gloves on one can hit harder ,smaller gloves 5/6 oz gloves one can throw faster ,more punches and is harder to see ...put 6oz gloves on Dempsey and 10 oz on any top HW post 60's i cant see how the out come changes..... When Dempsey fought at 190 or whatever the better fighter than had a distinct advantage because defense was not used property giving the aggressive fighter to mug his opponents more . There is a distinct era to era of polishing of avoiding punching ,mainly foot work and MUCH better jabbing .

If you cant beat a bigger man you shouldnt be in the weight class its that simple and crazy blaming big guys bc its an advantage ,thats nonsense ...lol

"You have to be above 220 to get out of CW now. " Im not sure what this is ?


You are also once again evading why size doesn't matter and blatently ignored my two flawless posts above and then mention 96% were the greatest but ignored that they had size advantage most of the time ?

 

Joe Louis.

 

Size matters , but can be overcome .
Size cannot be overcome when you have 2 equally talented and equally skilled mammals of 2 differing sizes competing against the other .

In fighting , if you have 2 fighters with the same talent and skills, meaning , p4p, the same speed, p4p same power, p4p same stamina, agility ect ect ect...

1 is 5'8" 175 lbs
1 is 6'2" 225 lbs

Who do you think is going to win on average considering they have the same everything ???

Kind of answers itself
No ?

 

Louis is a bit tricky bc he himself fought around under 200 pounds with not many guys over 210 and maybe 5 over 220 . Most of his k.os were that of lighter opponents than himself or a insignificant difference so to show a steady decline doesnt exist . Baer of 240 did knock him out of the ring once and Galento a 235 pounder knocked him down twice ,Simon wasnt anything special and Carnera was below Buddy Baer which is another topic in skill. Yea you can claim Louis k.od all sizes but technically you arent showing much bc the average HW was around 200 pounds .

 

this could be seen as very dismissive toward old time boxing.

 

I'm surprised this thread is still going!

Size and weight matter. And I when I say weight I mean low body fat at 230 or more, not some fat guy who weights 280.

From 1990 on, the lineal champion or #1 guy has almost always been a super heavyweight type. The anomaly was Holyfield who on fair score cards is 1-4 vs Lewis and Bowe

Even today the champions are huge and really not that good, yet we see no cruiserweights, a division with some talent trying to move up.

Long range artillery and power make combine with modern gloves that have more padding have essentially made the smaller boxer types endangered species.

While a small power puncher with skills can still win, giving up 5-6 inches in height and reach vs an opponent who's also skill is not going to be easy. The smaller man has to in-fight, and will need good body punching, hooks and uppercuts.

1 ) He has to get past a longer jab and right on the way in. This takes defense and more energy. Winning via out fighting is rarely an option giving up 5-6 inches in height and reach vs an opponent who's also skilled

2 ) The bigger guy might have better footwork / footspeed, hardly allowing it to happen.

3 ) Or the bigger guy might opt to clinch, lean his weight down / push off and re-set.


***So it's a tall order for the 5-9" to 6'1" fighter, under 220 pounds and like I said he'll need some power and durability. If that ruffles your feathers on past greats being #1 in modern times, you can only argue with the truth for so long. ***

 

All sports progress .