as a Defensive Tool ??? I see guys like Mayweather use it most effectively. Toney and Hopkins have clearly mastered this technique but I'm starting to see more and more B-Level fighters and former A-level fighters looking to re-invent themselves using this tactic.............YOUR THOUGHS!!!
as an amature I hate this style, I tried to really grasp it but without the amaysing speed and reflexes that Floyd has its really hard to get back on offence. its actualy quite easy to defend with the shoulder roll but getting back to a position where you can throw back is the tough part. for the most part alot of fighters are trying it because they see it work for other fighters and because you can defend well without useing as much energy (blocking and parrying is a whole lot more effective as a two way defence tool but uses more energy) MOSTLY fighters are either seeing if there fast enough to use it, or they're useing it as a way to defend without useing as much energy. at least thats my take.
It's just a defensive style. Fighters get respect if they use it well, like Mayweather or Toney. They're fun to watch when they use the system well and make guys miss punches over and over again and then counter effectively. Some guys, like DLH, aren't cut out for that particular brand of defense. It's the fighters can get the respect, not really the style.
Gatti uses it as well. Did it against Floyd. But was too slow for Floyds right hand and got nailed every time.
indeed. as was said its just not for some fighters just like not everyone should use a peek-a-boo style just because it worked for tyson. myself for instance I fight in a relaxed, counterpunching, Hopkins when hes not moveing back so much kindda style. when I get a guy hurt I finish well but I never LOOK for a KO. my style works for me, and when I've tried other styles in training it just dosent feel right. people know what comes naturaly...some fighters just keep trying to Re-invent themselves.
Thats the stance I fight in most comfortably as well. What Hopkins calls a 'fencing' stance, and in boxing it is sort of like that. I think fighting in the stance that Floyd Mayweather and James Toney use is more about timing than speed though. You don't really role punches in reaction to most punches, you react to them at first.. but if you are in a good rhythm, and you have your ahead around what your opponent is doing... its the best position to be in if you have your opponent well timed. IF you know want to counter a punch and know its coming, then rolling, slipping, or using any upper body movement to avoid the punch is preferable to blocking or parrying because the motion of the upper body movement puts you in perfect position to throw the counter but actually be able to turn your body into it.
Seeing De La Hotti trying it against Vargas was hilarious. He may as well had dropped his hands & stuck his chin out.
Huh? Does Bernard use the shoulder roll :huh I always thought he was doing the philly crab shell. As for Gatti, I think he wasnt really using the 'roll against Floyd, he just kept his left low.
I agree with you, footwork is the best tool when counterpunching anyways. its easyer to slip and dodge punches when you know how to pivot your feet. I actualy help in the gym to train new guys and the thing I drill into them is PIVOT YOUR FEET! its gotta be one of the most important and ignored part of counter punching:thumbsup
The philly crab shell...? Uh... Any Hopkins does roll is shoulder, but when he's defending, he doesn't just sit there with his left down, with his shoulder out a la Toney or Mayweather. Check out his last fight, with Pavlik, and watch him roll jabs from mid-outside range. Yeah, especially maintaing good BALANCE while dodging and countering. I've seen a lot of new boxers, that have reflexes so good they can slip and counter all day... or they could at least, if they didn't nearly fall down every time because their balance was so bad. I know balance is not one of the real exciting parts of boxing to learn.. but if you have good balance, there is no boxing technique that won't be easy to execute (At least at practice that is!).
