Why has Hopkins made this unwinnable match? Why does he think he can win?

Discussion in 'World Boxing Forum' started by McGrain, Feb 18, 2008.


  1. Decebal

    Decebal Lucian Bute Full Member

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    The real victor of Hopkins vs. Calzaghe will not be he who hits more whilst being hit less but he who turns out to be the more competent ring-general, the superior and more flexible strategic planner and implementor and the mentally stronger, more intelligent and artful operator.

    If Hopkins wins the mental battle prior to the fight, managing to force Calzaghe to enter the ring with an inappropriate attitude, if he proves to be the better ring-general on the night, implementing and asserting a winning strategy that catches Calzaghe by surprise and outwits him regularly, if he employs artful tricks of gamesmanship successfully to make Calzaghe lose his nerve and draw him into fighting scrappily, if he shows more will to win in the crucial moments of the fight, certain to be showcased with typical aplomb, Hopkins will be the moral victor in this encounter, irrespective of the number of effective punches thrown by Calzaghe in comparison, or the decision of the judges.

    Why has Hopkins taken this fight? Think how important the moral victory would be to him, against a formidable opponent like Calzaghe.

    Also, if he loses in a close fight, having fought impressively, he climbs up the p4p rankings, possibly even to around the Top 10 spot.

    http://www.eastsideboxing.com/forum/showthread.php?t=44518
     
  2. Sister Sledge

    Sister Sledge Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Hopkins doesn't have too many fights in him. he's fighting for legacy. I would have liked him to fight Jones myself, but if he's gonna go out, why not by fighting the best? I think he's gonna lose, but if he wins, his legacy goes up 3-4 notches in my book.
     
  3. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    Could have been luck. Could have been luck that saw him in that rarest of positions, a MW who stood to prophit greatly in terms of legacy/exposure by beating a WW in Felix Trinidad. Find me another example in history where the MIDDLE stood to imporve his standing more by winning, than the Welter did?

    And it could just have been luck that this happened a second time against De La Hoya - Hopkins became a superstar at the back of that fight. Hopkins played his part beautifully on both occasions, and prophited by it, massively.

    But it isn't JUST on those massive occasions. Hopkins has plenty of defences, but not a GREAT resume. For many of those wilderness years he created buzz and exposure for himself by playing the role of the bad guy, right down to the wrestling mask.

    Finally, old and weight drained, he created two massive matches against the heir apparent in Taylor. I think that Hopkins did a beautiful job of publicising/hyping these two fights & I also found his tactical execution excellent. OK, he lost both (Though there is a case for him having won both) but he had no business at MW by that time anyway.

    So he fights ONE FIGHT up at LHW and becomes the #1 LHW in the world. Managerial genius. He then cements his place as the #1 LHW in the rold by beating up a blown up 154-160lb fighter. This is where he stands at the minute.

    This is GREAT career management. Why would you think otherwise?

    I think you're becoming confused by my position. I'm not attacking Hopkins. I consider him a great fighter, top 6 MW all time, top 60 p4p all time, but I still feel he's done a brilliant job of managing his career.
     
  4. MancMexican

    MancMexican Blood & Guts Forever Full Member

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    We're not talking about a prime hopkins here. Hopkins is looking at one last payday. He's going to retire, win, lose or draw, and knows this fight is going to put some zero's in his bank account and won't affect his legacy if he loses. IF he wins his stature goes through the roof.

    Of Hopkins' last 4 fights he has, however you scored the fights, not been able to convincingly beat Jermain Taylor, beat a smaller, fatter winky wright (at 160 this victory would have meant something) and beat Tarver, which I consider a great victory but that's 1 of the last 4 that gives Hopkins props.

    He's at the end of the road, old, past his best, going to fight an unbeaten p4p 2/3. He'll make lots of money, go out with a bang and if he wins it will be an incredible achievement but everyone will forgive him for losing, so what's actually to lose?

    Nothing, that's what. He can only win in this fight.

    That's why he's taken it.
     
  5. Benjiabc

    Benjiabc The Nottingham Hitman Full Member

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    could not of said it better myself:good
     
  6. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    Good post.

    But it's not under the skin of the problem in my opinion. Hopkins is so competitive. I just don't think he would take a match he thinks he will lose.

    Do you think he thinks he can win? If he does, why do you think he thinks this?

    As far as the money end goes, don't you think that Pavlik and Jones represent money fights that would present him with a much better chance of winning? Jones made millions last time out...
     
  7. VIP

    VIP Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Ok, cool. But I don't agree. Had Hopkins fought Trinidad circa 95-97 he would have destroyed him just as easily IMO, would have made a name for himself and could have had the BIG fights earlier when he was more in his physical prime. He had the patience though to wait so I admire that. He had to create the buzz otherwise no one would know of him, and didn't become a big name until Trinidad.

    Add these to his 1st loss in his 1st pro fight at 175. His fight in France, and in Ecuador where he was KD multiple times. And also there was a fight where he took a fight in something like 6 hours notice lol. Doesn't sound like a guy a guy who was managed beautifully. Add to that there was probably better ways to get his 1st title than face off against a phenom named Roy Jones.

    The Winky fight? Hopkins don't even get much credit for that. Nobody even wants to fight Winky, but Hopkins did on his own choice.
     
  8. Decebal

    Decebal Lucian Bute Full Member

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    Yeah, he doesn't really have anything to lose, only to win...not to mention the money.
     
  9. VIP

    VIP Boxing Addict Full Member

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    In his mind, yes, I think Hopkins thinks he can win. He obviously enjoys the challenge though and the thought that noone gives him a chance.
     
  10. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    Care to speculate as to what Hopkins think might be weak abot Joe's game? What he might have seen?

    If anyone can "see" the weakness, it's Hopkins - but I thought that Calzaghe's adaption v Kessler was astounding.
     
  11. RealIzm

    RealIzm Boxing Junkie banned

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    Well it's understood that Joes high workrate leaves himself open with his head forward.....however Joe has quick feet and can get in and out of the pocket with ease....I'm not confident that Bhop can capitalize on Joes small window of vulnerability:deal
     
  12. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    Joe also has good "tiny" head movement, like he can roll or slide or move the tiniest bit with a punch on impact. It doesn't sound like much but it makes all the difference, especially against a pot shoter.

    Right hand counter v a southpaw? Would Joe ever get that seriously square? I mean, on enough occasions that that punch becomes a serious factor?
     
  13. VIP

    VIP Boxing Addict Full Member

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    I'm not exactly sure. Have to study this man Calzaghe more closely myself. But yer fights against Kessler/Lacy are not real good indicators. Kessler is excellent at what he does but apart from that can't do much else, too many 1-2's. Hopkins is a way more diverse fighter. Calzaghes' offense is brilliant, but his defense not so, and is often vulnerable and open. Maybe take a look at some of his closer fights against Reid, Bika and a few others. He's been down, he's been hurt before. Calzaghe should be the rightful favourite, and if I had to bet my house, I'd put it on Calzaghe. But Hopkins is a very live underdog.
     
  14. PrideOfWales

    PrideOfWales Winston Zedmore Full Member

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    Joe is not going to fight his normal fight on 19th April. The fact of the matter is that Calzaghe has absolutely zero respect for both Hopkins' punch output and more importantly, punch power. Joe Calzaghe is 100% intent on stopping Bernard Hopkins, I'm convinced of it. If Hopkins gets stopped then none of them benefit that much apart from financially.
     
  15. RealIzm

    RealIzm Boxing Junkie banned

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    While I hope Joe stops Bhop....I cant see him changing whats got him where he is today....For Joe to change **** up could be a catastrophe.....If Joe carries out his usual gameplan maybe being abit more vicious in his attack(Think the Lacy fight) then I think Joe can stop Hopkins:yep

    Also Joes money punch should be the uppercut espescially against Hopkins who leads with his head down all the time:deal