Why I think GGG is a top 15 all-time middleweight.

Mendoza · Sep 16, 2018

McGrain said: ↑

Where are you getting these from? I ask because there were some ringsiders that scored for Alvarez and they seem to be unreflected here.

They include Roy Jones, Robert Garcia and Andrew Ward.

Also, I have never in my life seen so many drawn cards. There are twenty-one drawn cards there! 21 drawn, 30 something for one guy and zero for the other has to be the strangest spread of media cards i've ever seen.

Also, it should be stated that there is a difference between ringside cards and media cards.

Anyway, all very strange.
Click to expand...

Hopkins was in Canelo's corner, he doesn't count. Ward claims GGG didn't want to fight him, but let's see his card and I'll add his score to the below names:

Brian Campbell (CBS sports): 116-112 Golovkin
Dan Rafael (ESPN): 114-114 draw
Salvador Rodríguez (ESPN Mexico): 114-114 draw
Gareth A Davies (The Telegraph): 116-112 Golovkin
Josh Peter (USA Today): 115-113 Golovkin
Sports Illustrated: 114-114 draw
Dylan Hernandez (LA Times): 115-113 Golovkin
Lance Pugmire (La Times): 114-114 draw
*******: 114-114 draw
Chris Mannix (Yahoo! Sports): 115-113 Golovkin
Kevin Iole (Yahoo! Sports): 114-114 draw
The Guardian: 116-112 Golovkin
Joe DePaolo (Washington Post): 115-113 Golovkin
The Associated Press: 114-114 draw
Bill Simmons (HBO and The Ringer): 114-114 draw
Steven Muehlhausen (Sporting News): 116-112 Golovkin
Michael Montero (MonteroOnBoxing): 115-113 Golovkin
George Willis (New York Post): 114-114 draw
Jeff Powell (Daily Mail): 116-113 Golovkin
Mike Coppinger (Ring Magazine): 114-114 draw
Sherdog . com: 116-112 Golovkin
Jai Bednall (news . com . au): 115-113 Golovkin
Brian Mazique (Forbes): 114-114 draw
Adam Abramowitz (Ring Magazine and SN Boxing): 115-113 Golovkin
Tom Craze (Bad Left Hook): 116-112 Golovkin
Fraser Coffeen (Bloody Elbow): 115-113 Golovkin
Matt Christie (Boxing News): 115-114 Golovkin
Below The Belt Podcast: 115-113 Golovkin
World Boxing News: 115-113 Golovkin

Harold Lederman (HBO Sports): 116-112 Golovkin
Brian Campbell (CBS sports): 116-112 Golovkin
Salvador Rodríguez (ESPN Mexico): 114-114 draw
Gareth A Davies (The Telegraph): 116-112 Golovkin
Josh Peter (USA Today): 115-113 Golovkin
Dylan Hernandez (LA Times): 115-113 Golovkin
Lance Pugmire (La Times): 114-114 draw
Box Scene: 114-114 draw
Chris Mannix (Yahoo! Sports): 115-113 Golovkin
Kevin Iole (Yahoo! Sports): 114-114 draw
The Guardian: 116-112 Golovkin
Joe DePaolo (Washington Post): 115-113 Golovkin
Mike Coppinger (Ring Magazine): 114-114 draw
Sherdog: 116-112 Golovkin
Jai Bednall (news.com.au): 115-113 Golovkin
Brian Mazique (Forbes): 114-114 draw
Adam Abramowitz (Ring Magazine and SN Boxing): 115-113 Golovkin
Tom Craze (Bad Left Hook): 116-112 Golovkin
Fraser Coffeen (Bloody Elbow): 115-113 Golovkin
The Associated Press: 114-114 draw
Bill Simmons (HBO and The Ringer): 114-114 draw
Steven Muehlhausen (Sporting News): 116-112 Golovkin
Michael Montero (MonteroOnBoxing): 115-113 Golovkin
Matt Christie (Boxing News): 115-114 Glolovkin
George Willis (New York Post): 114-114 draw
Below The Belt Podcast: 115-113 Golovkin
World Boxing News: 115-113 Golovkin
Jeff Powell (Daily Mail): 116-113 Golovkin

Mendoza · Sep 16, 2018

Seamus said: ↑

The robbery claim is idiotic. It was a close, hard to score fight. I thought GGG won but again the cards were all within one or two points of mine. Big deal. Excellent fight.
Click to expand...

Not when you have a sample of 30 + cards, and all of point to one winner, with none saying Canelo won. You are on the correct side here.

It was a good fight, but once again the judges were crap. I want to see their cards round by round.

McGrain · Sep 16, 2018

Mendoza said: ↑

Hopkins was in Canelo's corner, he doesn't count.
Click to expand...

That's fair.

On the other hand, all the writers you've quoted who predicted a Golovkin win are arguably compromised too.

So let's weed them out.

surfinghb · Sep 16, 2018

Not a great fight overall for me .. First 9 rounds was a chess match, both fighters very cautious and unwilling to let it go, they were holding back … 10, 11 ,12 were awesome. The problem GGG had is that after the first fight, he had to have known that basically he needed a KO or close to that to win … Should he "have" to fight like that, absolutely not .. But he waited to long to start mixing it up more .. His jab and footwork was good and he landed the best shots of the night with his uppercuts. Canelo had good body work at times and also landed some clean shots up stairs .. Very close fight, in no way a robbery, but GGG a winner to me by 2 points .. Let's face it, the more popular fighter got the nod in both fights ..

Mendoza · Sep 16, 2018

McGrain said: ↑

That's fair.

On the other hand, all the writers you've quoted who predicted a Golovkin win are arguably compromised too.

So let's weed them out.
Click to expand...

With 40+ names I listed, you can weed out 10...not one says Canelo is the winner. Also, weed out anyone from Kaz or Mexico, or with an ax to grind. Deal?

I think its very telling when ESPN Mexico says draw, and that is the best Canelo has.

The judging in boxing has a real problem flipping these 8-4, 7-4-1 and 7-5 cards the other way around. These judges give every possible close round to the promoters guy. Even more outrageous is giving rounds where the promoter's man lost to him...especially late in the fight As long as the fans tolerate it, expect more...damaging the integrity of the sport.

Drill down, you'll see many of these rounds that were flipped were done make sure the promoter's cash cow won it. This is why I want to see how the last three rounds were scored.

janitor · Sep 16, 2018

Unfortunately Golovkin looks set to be the Sam Langford figure of our generation, which is something that I hoped never to see in my lifetime!

McGrain · Sep 16, 2018

Mendoza said: ↑

With 40+ names I listed, you can weed out 10...not one says Canelo is the winner. Also, weed out anyone from Kaz or Mexico, or with an ax to grind. Deal?
Click to expand...

No, don't worry about it, i'm just bestirring you.

I want to see how the last three rounds were scored.
Click to expand...

The judges awarded either 2 or 3 of the last three rounds to Golovkin.

McGrain · Sep 16, 2018

janitor said: ↑

Unfortunately Golovkin looks set to be the Sam Langford figure of our generation
Click to expand...

Wash your mouth out.

dinovelvet · Sep 16, 2018

Mendoza said: ↑

With 40+ names I listed, you can weed out 10...not one says Canelo is the winner. Also, weed out anyone from Kaz or Mexico, or with an ax to grind. Deal?

I think its very telling when ESPN Mexico says draw, and that is the best Canelo has.

The judging in boxing has a real problem flipping these 8-4, 7-4-1 and 7-5 cards the other way around. These judges give every possible close round to the promoters guy. Even more outrageous is giving rounds where the promoter's man lost to him...especially late in the fight As long as the fans tolerate it, expect more...damaging the integrity of the sport.

Drill down, you'll see many of these rounds that were flipped were done make sure the promoter's cash cow won it. This is why I want to see how the last three rounds were scored.
Click to expand...

https://www.boxingforum24.com/threa...djustments-and-win-easy-or-tko-canelo.613474/

What adjustments did he make..none.

Mendoza · Sep 16, 2018

surfinghb said: ↑

Not a great fight overall for me .. First 9 rounds was a chess match, both fighters very cautious and unwilling to let it go, they were holding back … 10, 11 ,12 were awesome. The problem GGG had is that after the first fight, he had to have known that basically he needed a KO or close to that to win … Should he "have" to fight like that, absolutely not .. But he waited to long to start mixing it up more .. His jab and footwork was good and he landed the best shots of the night with his uppercuts. Canelo had good body work at times and also landed some clean shots up stairs .. Very close fight, in no way a robbery, but GGG a winner to me by 2 points .. Let's face it, the more popular fighter got the nod in both fights ..
Click to expand...

I'd say this was a very good fight. An 8 on a scale of 1-10.

Canelo was better conditioned this time. He's a tough dude, with the right type of body size to cover up well. He has good hand speed, can counter, and goes to the body well. Vastly improved from his lone loss to Mayweather, I think we saw Cannel's best in his prime at age 28.

The problem is these most popular house fighters end up winning when the vast majority has it 2 rounds for the other guy. Glolovkin should boot his trainer. He could have landed more to the top of Canelo', where his guard was covering his chin and face.

Whoever Canelo'ss cut man was did an amazing job. There must have been crazy glue on that cut.

Gatekeeper · Sep 16, 2018

Golovkin should have known he had to win by a big margin after the first fight and he couldn't do it.

surfinghb · Sep 16, 2018

Mendoza said: ↑

I'd say this was a very good fight. An 8 on a scale of 1-10.

Canelo was better conditioned this time. He's a tough dude, with the right type of body size to cover up well. He has good hand speed, can counter, and goes to the body well. Vastly improved from his lone loss to Mayweather, I think we saw Cannel's best in his prime at age 28.

The problem is these most popular house fighters end up winning when the vast majority has it 2 rounds for the other guy. Glolovkin should boot his trainer. He could have landed more to the top of Canelo', where his guard was covering his chin and face.

Whoever Canelo'ss cut man was did an amazing job. There must have been crazy glue on that cut.
Click to expand...

He waited to long .. Are you telling me that wasn't a chess match for 9 rounds? In this magnitude of a fight given the circumstances of the 1st, that's too long

McGrain · Sep 16, 2018

surfinghb said: ↑

He waited to long .. Are you telling me that wasn't a chess match for 9 rounds? In this magnitude of a fight given the circumstances of the 1st, that's too long
Click to expand...

I didn't feel that way, for sure.

And round six was pretty violent.

HerolGee · Sep 16, 2018

i think you need to rank all the guys who beat elites, above him.

McGrain · Sep 16, 2018

Pretty shocking that this loss has narrowed the poll so dramatically, that seems odd.

Log in or Sign up

Why I think GGG is a top 15 all-time middleweight.

Is Golovkin a top 15 all time great at middle weight?

Yes

No

Mendoza Hrgovic = Next Heavyweight champion of the world. banned Full Member

Mendoza Hrgovic = Next Heavyweight champion of the world. banned Full Member

McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

surfinghb Boxing Junkie Full Member

Mendoza Hrgovic = Next Heavyweight champion of the world. banned Full Member

janitor VIP Member Full Member

McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

dinovelvet Antifanboi Full Member

Mendoza Hrgovic = Next Heavyweight champion of the world. banned Full Member

Gatekeeper Well-Known Member Full Member

surfinghb Boxing Junkie Full Member

McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

HerolGee Loyal Member banned Full Member

McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

Log in or Sign up

Forums

Why I think GGG is a top 15 all-time middleweight.

Is Golovkin a top 15 all time great at middle weight?

Yes

No

Mendoza Hrgovic = Next Heavyweight champion of the world. banned Full Member

Mendoza Hrgovic = Next Heavyweight champion of the world. banned Full Member

McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

surfinghb Boxing Junkie Full Member

Mendoza Hrgovic = Next Heavyweight champion of the world. banned Full Member

janitor VIP Member Full Member

McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

dinovelvet Antifanboi Full Member

Mendoza Hrgovic = Next Heavyweight champion of the world. banned Full Member

Gatekeeper Well-Known Member Full Member

surfinghb Boxing Junkie Full Member

McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

HerolGee Loyal Member banned Full Member

McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member