Why I think GGG is a top 15 all-time middleweight.

In terms of talent and H2H GGG is easily a top 10 MW all time and is closer to 5 than he is 10.

But his resume is lacking. And the 20 title defenses is BS too. There are only 4 major belts. The WBA "regular" championship is not a major belt. His first major title was against Rosado when I guess Geale vacated the WBA super championship

 

Dozo , if we're using your own criteria on Hopkins , then that surly means you rank him far higher than GGG , right? Just look at all top guys he dominated post 34 years old when he was past prime.

#5 Autwun Echols (35)
#3 Keith Holmes (36)
#2 P4P Felix Trinidad (36)
#8 Carl Daniles (37)
#2 Willy Joppy (38)
#2 Robert Allen (39)
#1 Robert Eastman (40)


Thats six guys Hopkins beat 35+ who were ranked top 5 by Ring and one guy ranked top 2 on the P4P list.

Thats more top 5'ers post 35 than GGG beat in his whole career.

As it stands he holds three top 5 wins against #2 Jacobs , #4 Lemiux and #3 Geale. Six top 5 rankers beats three wouldn't you say?

Fast forward a few years later and he beat undefeated Ring and Lineal Champ Kelly Pavlik at 43 years old.

So Hopkins spent 4 years as the Ring/Lineal champ and also beat and embarrassed another Ring / Lineal champ when he was a 43 year old codger.

What do you make of that incredible achievement ?

 

Nunn`s tactics were all wrong in that fight, he stayed in range despite his reach and often just lay on the ropes taking shots from a sharp but much smaller Starling

 

" I see both sides of the debate. My eyes tell me Triple G is great or at least was/he does seem to be fading of late- which is unfortunate because he was CLEARLY avoided by everyone in the division for years. So now haters will come out of the woodwork and claim he only looked as good as he did- because of the level of fighter around him. My eyes and his amateur record tell a different story.
On the other side their is no way to skirt the issue- the names on his resume on not top quality. His resume IS light.

I see Triple G Landing in the top 20 I believe he could hang with anyone the version of 3 years ago. But eventually people will pick against him in fantasy matchups because he doesn’t have any great names on his ledger.

Jacobs and Canelo are two very good wins.
Lemieux and the rest are ok.
It’s a nice resume but not ATG worthy.
But that happens when you have an extensive amateur career and a rep as a destroyer in the pros.
I hope he get at least 2 more good wins."

Great post.

The 2013-2014 period was his peak. His stamina would serve him well in 15 round fights in mythical matchups. H2H I can't come up with ten middleweights being favored over him. As for his resume, he can only fight who enters the ring with him. If he was Mexican, American, or British, how much would those fan bases have affected his ability to get Cotto and Martinez in the ring with him? And would Golden Boy have been able to rob him in a fight against Canelo?

For me he makes top 10. For a swarmer to be rated the best pound for pound fighter at 35 is to my knowledge unprecedented. (Although I personally rate him behind Lomachenko and Crawford).

 

you guys are being premature, 3G hasnt hung up his gloves yet.

When hes finished, judge him against the guys who are retired. A partial resume isnt going to cut it, with very few exceptions (Mayweather, Pacman for example).

 

Really interesting discussion. I see both sides of you guys' arguments. Personally, I have him at number 22, for now. And these are the guys stopping his entry into my top 15:
15 Gibbons
16 H Williams
17 Charles
18 Jones Jr
19 Flowers
20 Zale
21 Conn
22 Golovkin

 

Bellow Nard Hopkins since that was just proven beyond all doubt using your own grading criteria.

This thread boosted the legacy of Hopkins 10 fold.

Lets also factor in Nard being Lineal and Ring Champ for 4 yeas which is a status Golovkin has yet to hold.

 

^ Notice how Dino avoided the question.

 

He beats both Hagler and Monzon so H2H he's the 160 GOAT

 

I am a Big fan of GGG but I think although he won the margins could have been larger vs Canelo & Jacobs, rematches may prove that GGG learns something from a tough fight. Thing is he is getting older.

However,I dont like the amount of punishment he takes with his defensive gaps in recent fights & that would hurt him in fights vs Greb,SRR,Hagler,Monzon,Ketchel,Etc, I think at this stage of his career he needs an addition to his corner & he needs to fight the best soon.

I think GGG will fight the best but his opponents are waiting for him to age. Canelo pulled out because he wanted the Mexican Beef Juice undetected, Jacobs may be the next best pick for a tough rematch.

 

If he was as great as you say he is , he wouldn't have been trying to fight welter weights while turning down a fight with Andre Ward who he was more closer to in size than Floyd and Cotto.
Its downright shameful to gloat about a big power house Middle weight like GGG being avoided by Cotto who was nearing the end of his career which played out at 147 , and it only highlight how shallow his resume is.

Cotto grabbing the MW crown off Martinez was an act of opportunism nothing more , he never had any intention ever of defending against MWs and everybody knew it. Essentially the title was hijacked by 154 pounders who defended it at a made up weight of 155.
If GGG wanted a challenge , there was plenty up at 168 who would have gave it to him , but he was too focused on being a bully by hoping and waiting smaller guys moved to take on the types of challenges he has never been prepared to take.

Btw , Martinez never avoided Golovkin. His career and body was at an end by the time Golovkin was making a name for himself. He had two fights left and GGG didn't have the name or drawing power to be considered.
If Martinez ducked GGG , then Vitali ducked Bermane Stiverne.

 

Correction. He never beat anybody over the age of 34 apart from a gift against Jacobs . But i guess he will soon enough against a guy he cherry picked from 154 who hasn't fought in two years