Why isn't Ali's performance in Ali vs Frazier II as highly rated as the Fight of the Century?

Discussion in 'World Boxing Forum' started by MorningSage, May 8, 2020.


  1. MorningSage

    MorningSage New Member Full Member

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    People talk about how he was closer to his prime in FOTC, and how it was a more entertaining fight with higher stakes. But it looks to me that we got as close to a prime 60s Ali as we ever would in an Ali-Frazier bout in their second fight.

    His dancing footwork and movement was on par with his pre-exile self, and he was able to maintain this for pretty much most of the fight. And Frazier wasn't able to dish out punishment like he did in FOTC.

    Apparently Frazier wasn't as good after FOTC and getting TKOed by Foreman, but that's on Frazier. How was the second fight not Ali's best performance in terms of skill and result?
     
  2. dmt

    dmt Hardest hitting hw ever Full Member

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    I rank it as Ali's #2 win, only behind Rumble.
     
  3. Somali Sanil

    Somali Sanil Wild Buffalo Man banned Full Member

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    Both had been beaten since the first fight, joe was seen as past it in 74 also
     
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  4. Johnny_B

    Johnny_B Well-Known Member banned Full Member

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    Cause Frazier was almost blind in one eye and had already lost to Foreman.
    Plus he was older, and the aging process affected him far more than Ali.
    Just like Tyson, Frazier was never meant to be successful in his 30's. Their bodies won't allow them to be.
    Short HW's with a small reach need to work a lot harder to get close enough to land their punches. That means they use up way more energy due to their fighting style. As you age, you can't maintain that rhythm.
    Om the other hand, tall guys with a good reach can always use their jab to keep their opponents at bay.
     
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  5. Rico Spadafora

    Rico Spadafora Master of Chins Full Member

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    Because he clinched like 127 times in that fight and illegally held the back of Frazier’s head?
     
  6. MorningSage

    MorningSage New Member Full Member

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    So? Doesn't mean that wasn't a good performance from Ali
     
  7. navigator

    navigator "Billy Graham? He's my man." banned Full Member

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    Overlooked because it was non-championship (NABF be damned) and only 12 rounds. And, as you said, not the bang for buck that I and III represented.
     
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  8. MorningSage

    MorningSage New Member Full Member

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    Joe already had his eye problem in FOTC.
    If he was so worn out, how did he become number one contender for his 3rd bout with Ali?
     
  9. shadow111

    shadow111 Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Frazier was much easier to beat by then. The rematch was seen as the most lackluster of the trilogy. Ali was on a bit of a surge whereas Joe was not viewed the same after he was demolished by Foreman.
     
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  10. Neon Maniac

    Neon Maniac Member Full Member

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    Ali struggled badly in that fight and was for the major of that fight smothered and ate a huge amount of body shots which on my scorecard gave him the fight but I count body shots as the rules indicate they count ? IDK. To add to this the commentary was very biased ,Ali was missing shots while they were cheering them on ,but they missed ? Very shady when Ali was getting talked up while missing shots ,but it was the Ali push ,he was boxing’s poster boy.
     
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  11. shadow111

    shadow111 Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    That's interesting that you scored it for Frazier. I do recall Frazier landing a lot of body shots, but not many head shots. Ali as the headhunter would make it hard to score against him while appearing to tee off on Frazier from the outside with the jab. Maybe it was Ali's poker face that won it getting hit with body shots but keeping a straight face not appearing to be affected by them.
     
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  12. Somali Sanil

    Somali Sanil Wild Buffalo Man banned Full Member

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    Where did anybody say it wasn’t a good performance ????
     
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  13. DavidC77

    DavidC77 Well-Known Member Full Member

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    Ali Frazier II was the very first Ali fight I saw all the way through.

    I saw it when it was shown on TV (ITV in the late 80's, I think. The programme was called Top Rank fights of the 70's).

    I was disappointed by both fighters, knowing that this was arguably the greatest heavyweight ever and the first guy who beat him.

    Frazier was particularly slow and Ali didn't seem to have much in his punches.

    Frazier I, Frazier III, Norton II and Foreman were all examples to me of significantly better performances by Ali but in all of them it was clear that this wasn't the insane calibre of fighter who battered Cleveland Williams.
     
  14. Somali Sanil

    Somali Sanil Wild Buffalo Man banned Full Member

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    It got worse, much worse..He had one fight in between being bounced by Foreman and the return fight with Ali for the title against burner...since when has earning your shot been working your way up ..???? It’s what the public want, rankings get juggled to suit, you do know that don’t you...Money talks
     
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  15. Somali Sanil

    Somali Sanil Wild Buffalo Man banned Full Member

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    Tbf David, foreman Norton and Frazier were way better than the Williams that Ali fought
     
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