Why never a Whitaker-Chavez rematch?

http://articles.chicagotribune.com/...70_1_pernell-sweet-pea-whitaker-lou-duva-king

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Chavez wasn't cut out for welterweight and really had little chance of beating Whitaker in a rematch so it would have made no real sense for him to take it. The money is nice but taking a fight you really can't win realistically on the back of a lucky gift draw is not a wise move for a top fighter.
Whitaker deserved better but you can't fault Chavez too much there.
Chavez could have publically admitted he'd lost but very few fighters do that unless they are ko'd or otherwise obliterated.

 

In hindsight of course the Randall fights did even less for his reputation but that wasn't as predictable at the time.

 

Pernell said it best, everyone knew he'd already won, so he didn't really need it but a decent fight for the fans.
Duva acting a bit too desperate. Whitaker was the welterweight champ, he needn't have been chasing JCC like that. JCC was just a 140 belt holder knocked back down to size. I guess Duva was reckoning Whitaker still couldn't draw well without Chavez, which is fair enough but it seems he was buying into the Chavez legend . Whitaker was by this time firmly established as a star of boxing.

Interesting that Barry McGuigan and Frank Warren had it close. I thought Whitaker won 7 or 8 of the rounds clearly for a clear win. It would be hard to find even 4 clear rounds for Chavez.

 

There was plenty going on, not least of all both camps being guaranteed $7 mil. That's enough money to chase, absolutely.

Over and above that Whitaker wanted his justice and kudo's for that imo. He had his revenge against Ramirez and he would have had it again here too.

Agree with your card, that about sums it up.

 

There should have been an investigation. Two judges scoring a draw 115-115.
The Whitaker score was 115-113 which is still somewhat generous to Chavez.

Other ringsiders all had Whitaker winning, from 115-113 to 117-111 or perhaps wider.

 

That's about the size of it. One of those iffy decisions that really annoyed me at the time.

 

Absolutely.

 

This is dated Nov. 93.

Chavez was already set to make his mandatory WBC LW defense against #1 Frankie Randall in January of 94. I believe if Chavez did well they probably would have got the rematch made in late 94 before Whitaker moved further up in weight.

Instead the fight was a disaster for Chavez, he was on the skid and that was that. Whitaker vs Chavez for the P4P crown no longer made sense. Whitaker moved on, and Chavez barely got his title back in time to cash out against the young phenom Oscar.

 

Even when trying to give rounds to Chavez, I struggle to find 4 rounds to give him.

 

Question to some here, Do you think the Ramirez or Chavez scoring was worse ?

 

Chavez strung together 6 wins in a row over almost 2 years prior to "cashing out" vs ODLH. I wouldn't call that barely getting his title back in time.

After Chavez beat Taylor King tried to put forth that Randall was fighting Whitaker and Chavez would fitght the winner. The Whitaker camp knew nothing about any of this and had no idea why they supposedly had to fight Randall before being granted a rematch vs Chavez. Chavez was still copping a lot of flak for the way the second Randall fight concluded (as well as the Whitaker robbery) so perhaps they thought they could kill off the noise by having Whitaker and Randall face each other.

The bottom line is King and Chavez talked a lot but did nothing.

Having said all this Chavez was well and truly on the decline when he fought Whitaker. Peak for peak they'd be a great match at 135 tho i can't see Julio doing a whole lot better.

 

If you consider the literal dates of the fight and not the promotion. The fight was in the works for a full year before it happened. It was pretty much a done deal for summer 96 by fall of 95.

"LAS VEGAS — His elbow hurts, his back and knees ache, and about all that keeps Julio Cesar Chavez from dropping out of boxing right now is the prospect of a $15-million payday next May against Oscar De La Hoya in Chavez's 100th and, he says, final fight."

http://articles.latimes.com/1995-09-16/sports/sp-46511_1_de-la-hoya

He was at his prime, and it was very difficult to get inside his defense," said De La Hoya, who hopes his new style is better suited for his impending move up to 140 pounds to fight Julio Cesar Chavez next May.

http://articles.latimes.com/1995-09-10/sports/sp-44427_1_de-la-hoya

Outside of Taylor II which was damage control after the Randall rematch, all those fights Julio squeezed in were low risk busy fights to keep him active and credible for the impending Oscar super bout. Heck one of them was actually a double header with Oscar to promote their fight. That's all Julio wanted at this stage as noted above.

There was no obligation to move back up and face Whitaker again, especially after the disastrous Randall fights damaged Julio's rep as the P4P King. Whitaker had rightfully moved on and Julio and Oscar were on a collision course.

Oh come on. Taylor moved up to welter to get an easy title and him..rather Duva wanted Chavez to move up and rematch him..

"In June or July, Taylor is expected to make his first welterweight defense, against Luis Garcia of Venezuela, who is 21-0 and the WBA's top contender. "Then the only guy he wants is Chavez -- at 147 pounds," said Dan Duva, Taylor's promoter. "But we're not going to chase him. If Chavez wants to make a lot of money, he has our phone number. He can call us."

I'm sorry, that's just stupid talk. What was Chavez's incentive to move up and avenge his own win, when he was looking at upcoming super fights with Angel and Macho Man in his own weight class?

And yeah, the second Taylor fight didn't really mean much when it happened. Both men were in a hard place, Taylor had lost his Welter title and was now willing to come back down, and as I said it was a rebuild fight for Julio who got negative press for Randall II.

I think he would do better for sure. Especially at 135.

 

The Taylor part of the quoted article is another matter and one that could be debated as well no doubt.

What is pertinent is the underlined, Chavez' own words -

Chavez has touched too many raw nerves lately. He dawdled for years before giving Taylor the rematch, waiting until the 1984 Olympic champion was seemingly completely shot. ("If I had won, you can bet the rematch would have been in six months," said Taylor.) He said he would fight Randall again and then Whitaker., and "if Don King and Dan Duva can't make that fight, I'll sit down with Whitaker."But he added both Randall and Whitaker must now fight him in Mexico. With their hands tied, perhaps.


Chavez never said anything about ODLH and nor did he look for the claimed fights with Whitaker and Randall.

ODLH was a novice at the time Whitaker fought Chavez. He was not a big name for some time after Whitaker-Chavez.

The bottom line is Chavez avoided a rematch with Whitaker, and another with Randall for that matter.

Chavez got $9 mil for fighting Oscar, Duva had offered him $7 mil 3 years prior to fight Whitaker again.

Chavez wanted no part of Whitaker again whilst we know full well Whitaker and co pursued the match with passion.