Even Julio Cesar Chavez declined a rematch with Pernell Whitaker, the same with Tito Trinidad to Oscar De La Hoya, Bernard B-hop Hopkins to Trinidad, Floyd Mayweather to Oscar, Sugar Ray Leonard to Marvin Hagler, Muhammad Ali to George Foreman, Joe Calzaghe to B-hop and so on Oscar avoided Antonio Margarito, Vernon Forrest and Winky Wright. Floyd Mayweather rejected an $8 million fight with Margarito and even against Miguel Cotto both of which Pacquiao annihilated. We know that Marquez gave Pacquiao a hard time but dont you forget that Pacquiao should have been awarded the title in their first bout because the judge who scored it a draw admitted afterward that he made a mistake. And Marquez was the one to turn down an immediate rematch with Pacquiao, not the other way around as many people believed. A prime Marquez instead fought and was defeated by Chris John in Indonesia. Even The Greatest Muhammad Ali had a hard time with Ken Norton in their 2 fights, which many believed the latter had won both times. Does that make Norton the greatest? Of course not. Whats wrong with Pacquiaos winning a vacant title? Even the Mexican legends won at least one vacant title in their careers like Marquez defeated Manuel Medina for the vacant IBF Feather title, Marco Antonio Barrera defeated Richie Wenton for the vacant WBO Super-bantam title then defeated Luiz Freitas for the vacant WBA Super-bantam title, Erik Morales defeated Paulie Ayala for WBCs vacant Feather title, Oscar De La Hoya defeated Jorge Paez for the vacant WBO Lightweight title then defeated Derrell Coley for the vacant IBA Welter title, Julio Cesar Chávez won his first championship against Mario Martinez for the vacant WBC Super-feather title and how many more greats fought for a vacant title? Even Chavez, Roy Jones Jr and B-hop fought for and won a vacant title as their first. Whats wrong with Manny Pacquiaos title wins with a catch-weight? Of all Pacmans fights, only 2 have been catch-weights. The title fights vs Cotto at 145 for the 147 title and vs Margarito at 150 for the 154 title. Oscar asked Pacman to jump 2 divisions to fight him in their non-title Welterweight bout the same way Floyd asked Marquez in their non-title Welter bout. There should be no problem with catch-weight if both parties agreed. So whats the fuss with Pacquiao? Paul Williams asked a catch-weight of 158 and yet got KOd by Sergio Martinez for the 160 title. Even the great Sugar Ray Leonard did it twice, defeating Donny Lalonde at 168 for the 168 & 175 titles and defeating Thomas Hearns at 164 for the 168 title, the middleweight title rematch of Jermain Taylor vs Kelly Pavlik was fought at 166, Trinidad-Jones at 171 for the 175 non-title bout and Oscar vs B-hop at 158 for the 160 title where many thought Oscar was too small for the middleweight class. If thats the case for a 5ft9in Oscar, how much more for a smaller man like Pacquiao against middleweights Sergio Martinez or Paul Williams? Do these catch-weights affect Leonards or Floyds or Oscars greatness? NO. So it shouldnt affect Pacquiaos greatness. Many boxers are willing to fight in catch-weights to fight the best, for big money so dont just blame Manny Pacquiao for it. Pacquiao wont fight Martinez or Paul Williams? Oscar himself, a 5 foot 9 natural welterweight, realized after his defeat from B-hop that hes too small to be a middleweight and even Shane Mosley, a natural welter, wont dare venture to middleweight because of the same belief. So why Pacquiao, a natural super-lightweight, is a lesser fighter if he opted not to fight any middleweights or if he fight with a catch-weight? Even Martinez himself thought Pacquiao is too small for him. When Pacquiao fights Andre Berto and if he wins, will you say Berto didnt have enough experience to compete with Pacquiao.? Or when he fights Floyd Mayweather and if he dominates him, will you say Floyd has been inactive for too long.? Or when he fights Marquez and if he beats him, will you say 144 was too heavy for Marquez? All of this has been an afterthought. Since the first Barrera fight up to now, many people picked the other guy one way or the other because of their size advantage against Pacquiao and ending up disappointed many times over, including you (the doubters). And then the excuses come in. How many fighters have you seen fight bigger current or former champions even with or without a catch-weight and beat them up in such a fashion? And how many fighters have you seen show mercy to his beaten opponent the way Pacquiao did against Margarito? I really want Pacquiao to fight Floyd or Berto to get his 5th Lineal title as Rings Welterweight Champion in a box-off between no1 vs no2 or no1 vs no3 fighters of the division. Or a third fight with the WHINER Juan Manuel Marquez. Its true that Pacmans era is not yet over not because Pacman, Floyd and Martinez havent fought yet but because Pacmans still fighting. Nonetheless, Pacquiaos legacy is sealed. For all of Pacmans success and all the multi-division titlists in history, its not unusual. Maybe its unusual because Pacquiao is Asian and not African American.
No explanation really needed. Everyone knows why Pac is an ATG. There's just a few that let their self pride get the better of them and pretend to be blind to his greatness and will use pathetic excuses to say he is not when the reality is the truth is very painful to them.
Good write up. Think Pac is great as i do Mayweather. just hope they get it on. Regardless of who wins that fight, they are both ATG's in my opinion, but both for different reasons. Pac for his ability and courage to fight anyone, regardless and wins, and Mayweather for his god given ability, who i think is the most skilled boxer of out generation. Big up to both and to go back to the topic, PAC is DEF an all-time great.
We should just appreciate fighters like pacquiao instead of trying to pull holes in their achievements in the ring
why does everyone have a boner over Pac and Mayweather fighting Martinez? But yea, I skimmed over and did see a fair amount of good points.
Good thread/post but there's no need to explain anyway, it's very obvious why he's an ATG, no one active can come close to his record and accomplishments. Chavez Sr.'s record is **** poor compared to Pacquiao, Pacquiao's record and achievements in boxing make Sr. look like Jr.
Pacquiao is an ATG fraud. He's a decent fighter but he suddenly becamse great by beaten ruined fighters, and Mayweather leftovers.
I'm saying this as a long time Mayweather fan... Mayweather is scared of Pac. Pac is something special. Although I still think a confident Mayweather wins. It will never happen unfortunately.
That's what I was going to say. I feel the TS waisted alot of time with stating the obvious. Pac being an alltime great is not debatable. Even if this was targeted at the most Idiotic of posters, It was a waiste of time. Not even the guys who are called *****s daily would disagree that Pac is an Alltime great.