Why wasn't Hagler more aggressive vs. Duran and Leonard?

I never thought of Hagler as an overly aggressive fighter anyway. The Hearns fight aside, he was more of a boxer-puncher. I would say close to half of his title fights, the other fighter was more the aggressor. We're not talking about Joe Frazier here.

 

Potato patato. You're basically saying the same thing as PP.

 

Cheers.

 

Back at you JT :good

 

I disagree.
I think he was over-confident, and didn't consider either guy a "step up". He considered them SMALL, weak guys.

Leonard had struggled with Kevin Howard and been off three years since then. Everyone reckoned Hagler would KO him, possibly blind him permanently or even KILL him.
Why would Hagler be any less confident than everyone else in the world ?

Duran was an aging, blown-up lightweight, had never fought a middleweight at all. Had lost to Kirkland Laing.

Neither guy was a rated middleweight contender, or had ever beaten one.


Hagler was a STRONG middleweight, and had beat some BIG strong mofos. Rated, full-blown middles, and 'super-middles'.
He wasn't worried about lightweights and detached-retina-having rusty blown-up welters.

He was expected to run them over. Logically.
He was over-confident.
And I suspect during the fights he thought he was outboxing them comfortably (Duran he certainly DID).

Hearns, being 6'1 and a phenomenal puncher, was probably the guy who he was more concerned about, hence not over-confident.

 

I agree with this to an extent. While I do think Hagler was very adaptable to a variety of styles I feel he was most comfortable in this role as well. I the Leonard fight he actually became more aggresive towards the later rounds, and although he nipped it on my card he came up just short where it counted.

 

He was actually known more as a boxer early in his career. Think the Hearns fight changed the perception & then revisionist history kicked in.

 

I never said he himself considered them a step up. I said when the opposition stepped up, meaning vs better fighters and bigger names.

Hagler had always come in 100% ready and got the job done superbly vs fighters he was expected to demolish, why not for SRL? Because SRL had the class and skill to make life different, while at the same time for some reason god only knows Hagler come out orthodox and passive. This was confidence?

Why did he not come out and at least try to get the job done everyone expected of him? Because the nature and size of the occasion allied to SRL's prestige, skill and aura had him doing things he wouldn't otherwise be doing. He was confused. By the time he finally realised the error of his ways he'd given SRL a head start. Carlos Monzon (in attendance from memory) said he'd done it all wrong in regards to fighting smaller guys. Monzon would not have made the same mistake.

Duran was coming off the Moore destruction. Did you not notice Hagler fought at various times as if they were at 135 and he was fighting peak Duran? How about when he had Duran in serious trouble and wilting then eased right off for a couple of rounds? In the post fight interview he mentioned plenty of worries he had during the event. He sure didn't consider Duran no bloated 135 representing little danger. This was a guy suffering overconfidence? Not likely, certainly not for mine.

Someone needed to tell him that.

Duran he did outbox indeed, but the fact is he suffered a real hammering post fight as most thought his performance vs Duran stunk. When he should have been pressing his weight and strength advantage he was backing off. This was cautiousness, not overconfidence. Tho a win it was from from the expected impressive performance, even given Duran's superb showing and guile.

He had long spoken about Hearns as if he was a sure win. More so than Duran pre-fight actually. He said he didn't rate Hearns whatsoever.

The correct tactics and gameplan were chosen here, tho it was pretty clear cut. He was hardly going to outbox or outjab Hearns at long range, and Hearns slashing punches would be extremely dangerous to his scar tissue the longer the fight went. Even fighting cautious he would have worn plenty of sharp punches around the brow. It wasn't rocket science. However it was the perfect gameplan carried out brilliantly, all credit to him in this one.

He would not have been able to pull off the same dramatic scene vs Duran and SRL tho, due to various factors. He should tho have put on much more sustained pressure. I still believe he may have had doubts over his stamina after gassing out a bit a couple of times years earlier.

 

Yep.

Styles bothered Marvin and he looked so much better with the guys that suited him. Then, he does look Marvelous and blasts out guys. Even that Geraldo fight showed problems Marvin was going to have though. Or go back to the Briscoe and Hart bouts. But if an opponent cooperates with what Hagler wants guy to do, they are in big big trouble. Guys like duran and Leonard aren't going to put themselves in that position that a guy like an Alan Minter does. And it sure does change things.

With Marvin, it's not as cut and dry as a Kenny Norton matchup, because Marvin is capable of winning anyway. It just won't be the a+ results. But it does revolve back to a style thing. The other other about Jones-Hagler is interesting about this same issue. There's another guy that is definately not going to play lets cooperate with Marvin game, is he?

 

In truth...YES:yep

When the fight was announced it was the 1st time that I'd ever thought that Roberto could be on the receiving end of a hiding what with Hagler being at his peak & Roberto in all reality in the twilight of his boxing days & should'nt be in the ring with a monster like Hagler who i perceived as did everyone else too be too big & too good at the weight. Hagler was thee main man & thee Undisputed Middleweight & P4P KING & yer just did'nt know what sort of Roberto would turn up?

But Duran whipped himself into magnificent shape (He had too) & shocked everyone with his guile & ring savvy to stay the coarse & for me & what many at that time regarded as a brilliant performence of boxing nous from Roberto when all the advantages & every aspect of his opponant pointed too a complete miss-match & eventual utter beatdown.

He may have lost but it was a Champion performence just to stay the 15 rounds & i just don't get the controversy about the fact that Duran nearly won the fight just as SRL employed a similer application of boxing nous to upset Hagler's rythem. Yer can't hail one without the other with regard to Duran's & Leonards showings in their respective fights with Hagler.

Duran's performence was truly exceptional once you take on board all the intangibles & after that heroic performence millions more flocked to Duran's banner from the younger generation who where astounded by the guts & balls of Duran too step up & face the monster where other fient hearts feared to tread such as SRL & Hearns when opportunity was presented:deal

 

Well i'm glad someone got it/liked it

Cheers

 

Simply 'very bad' tactical mistakes,,,,,,,,,,

He took it 'too easy for too long',,,,,,,,,,

I'm sure he figured,,,,,,,I can turn it on anytime that I want, and Knock this guy out.

I think the Vito Antuofermo 'I' fight,,,,, was always in the back of his head,,,,,,,
where Marvin dominated the bout for the first 9 Rounds, and then floundered down the stretch.

Marvin always so this in front of him,,,,,,,,

This content is protected

 

In hindsight.

 

this picture shows how solid Marvin was, but to be honest, later his upper body filled out a little more than in this picture.