Wilder is not and never was the 2nd best HW.

Discussion in 'World Boxing Forum' started by FastSmith7, Oct 10, 2021.


  1. dinovelvet

    dinovelvet Antifanboi Full Member

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    Defending Whyte for ducking and running down Ortiz for ducking is showing bias. . The WBC ordered Whyte vs Ortiz and Whyte turned it down.. Thats all there is to is it. If Ortiz turned down the opportunity to replace Miller than fair enough , thats a duck too.
    Does it mean they are both a pair of soup cans? I would give Ortiz a good chance to beat Whtye had they fought.
     
  2. Brighton bomber

    Brighton bomber Loyal Member Full Member

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    Whyte wanted to be mandatory, he's wanted to be mandatory for a long time, he wasn't being offered mandatory though was he. He was being offered some made up position to keep him from actually being mandatory and keep Breazeale mandatory. The fact you are ignoring that reality shows your bias.

    Being WBC 2nd mandatory has no precedent and doesn't actually guarantee Whyte a mandatory shot based on the WBC's own regulations because there's nothing in their rules about a 2nd mandatory. There would be nothing to prevent the WBC making someone else 1st mandatory ahead of Whyte according to the WBC's own rules, just like there's nothing in the WBC's rules saying Whyte's interim title doesn't offer him mandatory status and neither does his number 1 ranking, it didn't even guarantee him a final eliminator which is why Breazeale/Molina was mandated instead as an eliminator ahead of the number 1 ranked Whyte.

    Question why was Breazeale ever made mandatory? It was meant to be Stiverne/Povetkin which is understandable as Povetkin had been mandatory and Stiverne the former champion, but why was Breazeale/Stiverne ordered after Povetkin failed a doping test? Why not Whyte who stated he wanted it? Why then Breazeale/Molina, Molina was suspended at the time when it was mandated for a failed doping test. It wasn't even a final eliminator, the WBC denied it was a final eliminator, then changed there mind when they decided they wanted WIlder to fight Breazeale.

    As for who wins, I have always favoured Ortiz, due to styles. I won't pretend that Ortiz doesn't look the part, he looks very dangerous, but that's all he's ever done, look like he's a top 5 heavyweight, he's never proven it like Whyte. Whyte doesn't pass the eye test like Ortiz but then Whyte for the most part keeps winning for the most part and against far, far better opposition than Ortiz dares to face. It doesn't matter how good Ortiz looks, it's who he can beat that matters and in that regard Whyte is far more proven so should be favourite, even if I think Whyte loses.
     
  3. Mighty

    Mighty The Gypsy King banned Full Member

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    Better than bum Whyte
     
  4. FastSmith7

    FastSmith7 Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Can Wilders take AJs power? I don't think so.
    AJ is a good boxer, he tried boxing with Usyk and did have more success than anyone bar Briedis who is a tremendous boxer.
    AJ can set up his shots much better than Wilder who spams the same 2 punch combination over and over again, AJ would destroy Wilder on the inside and probably get a stoppage with an uppercut.
     
  5. dinovelvet

    dinovelvet Antifanboi Full Member

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    The situation is very simple. . Brazzele was first in line , who was to be second in line was to be determined by the winner of Ortiz vs Whtye. . But Whyte refused so Ortiz got the shot after Breazzele. You're attempting to over complicate a very simple situation. Had Whyte beaten Ortiz he would gotten his title shot in 2019. Ducking that eliminator set him back years.

    https://www.skysports.com/boxing/ne...red-to-fight-luis-ortiz-before-deontay-wilder

    Dillian Whyte ordered to fight Luis Ortiz before Deontay Wilder

    Whyte has been ordered to fight Luis Ortiz to decide the 'second mandatory', while Dominic Breazeale is the WBC's preferred challenger to Wilder.
     
  6. Brighton bomber

    Brighton bomber Loyal Member Full Member

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    How is it simple it's unprecedented?

    If it was simple then Whyte would of been given a final eliminator instead of Breazeale or Molina because he was ranked higher and was WBC intercontinental champion. If it was simple, Whyte being Silver and interim champion would of earned him a mandatory shot or at least the right to fight a final eliminator. If it was simple being ranked number 1 by the WBC for all those years would of earned him a mandatory shot. If it was simple when Whyte/Povetkin 2 was named an eliminator Whyte would of been made mandatory but was then told in wasn't a "Final" eliminator so he didn't have a mandatory shot and finally if it was simple they would of made Whyte/Ortiz a final eliminator for the mandatory instead of a made up number 2 mandatory position which legally gives him no rights to a mandatory shot.

    I'm not complicating things the WBC is complicating things with it's round about rules and constant flip flopping and lets not even start with how Wilder some how has only had 2 mandatory defences over a near 5 year reign.

    How would beating Ortiz have gotten Whyte a mandatory in 2019? Wilder fought a mandatory in 2019 and that was Breazeale which Whyte vehemently objected over. Wilder wouldn't have been eligible for a mandatory title shot until 2020. Wilder did fight Ortiz in 2019 that was a voluntary defence not a mandatory defence. Then in 2020 Wilder was tied into the Fury trilogy and never faced a mandatory after Breazeale so explain to me how Whyte some how magically gets a title shot in the meantime when nobody else did and especially as he technically wasn't even mandatory but some made up status called 2nd mandatory. The whole situation was bonkers.
     
  7. dinovelvet

    dinovelvet Antifanboi Full Member

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    The if , buts and why / Intercontinental, diamond , silver are of no concern. The WBC gave him a route to the title shot and when guys turn down these offers they tend to do themselves no favours. .
    It was also just bad timing for Whtye and I also believe PBC and Haymon were reluctant to give an Eddie Hearn fighter an opportunity to win Wilders belt.
    But all this is no fault of Otriz. He was willing to fight Whyte , Whyte wasn't willing to fight him.
     
  8. Brighton bomber

    Brighton bomber Loyal Member Full Member

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    Whyte didn't care who he fought as long as he got a mandatory title shot and the fact is he wasn't given that opportunity until now. Whyte/Ortiz was never for a mandatory shot but a 2nd mandatory shot which is meaningless, show me where in the WBC rules that would of gotten Whyte a shot? It's not there I looked myself, it guarantees Whyte nothing and with the way the WBC and elevated other fighters above him to get eliminators and mandatory shots why would he believe having this made up status gets him any closer.

    All the WBC had to do was make Ortiz/Whyte for the WBC mandatory not the 2nd mandatory the mandatory after Wilder beat Breazeale but for some reason they never did and have only now given Whyte a final eliminator vs Wallin and that was only after he took them to court this summer.