Wilfredo Gomez Title Run

Wilfredo Gomez beat no1 , aside of LaPorte maybe and Lupe Pintor . Does these 2 wins make him great ? And did he not cheat in any of them ?

 

He was a great fighter,but also one of the filthiest and most classless in recent memory.He got his just desserts upon his behavior and comments leading up to Chava's beating his ass.

 

But there's still an argument to be made that Gomez at least showed some heart and grit in sucking it up after that disasterous 1st round and at least got back into the fight before it was curtains for him in round 8.

 

I just watched the Derrik Holmes defense again and was surprised to see Gomez take so much abuse early on.

 

Gomez could be hit yeah, but it's not like he was a face-first fighter. He displayed some lovely evasive moves and great overall ring generalship. I think the Sanchez fight was the only fight I've seen where he was never in control of the fight.

As for the Holmes fight, well I would not call it abuse. He was caught by some very good right hands, but look what he did to Holmes once he got into his stride.

Mendoza was another opponent who had his moments against Gomez, but again, Gomez beat him up. I think some of the criticism against Gomez is nit-picking. If you look at his overall legacy, then by any definition he was a great fighter.

 

If you mean cheating is fighting dirty, then we'd have to call a whole bunch of champion's wins and legacies into question.
His wins didn't come about because he was cheating; they came about because he was simply better than 98% of anybody he ever fought.

I take it you discount the Zarate win because of the punch when Zarate was down? I agree he was very lucky not to get a DQ, but at no point in that fight did Zarate look like a winner. He was getting beat up.

 

Is taking steroids allowed ? is hitting a downed opponent allowed ? Y is hitting low or hitting a downed opponent more allowed than taking steroids or loading gloves ?

It is your opinion and d vast majority of this forum's opinion that cheating doesn't matter 2 who wins d fight , but it was proven over , over and over and yet again and again that u r idiots , and again u r wrong .

U probably think that Zarate could not win ? did Gomez look like a winner until he had Zarate down and then hit him again while he was down ? Is it impossible that Zarate could survive a knockdown and stop Gomez later ?

Gomez is vastly overrated . N Edwin Valero caliber of a fighter but possibly less because regarding Valero , at least i don't recall any controversy in his wins , and watching 2 of them , he fought according 2d rules as well , so he deserved his on record achievement . Gomez fought d better opponents overall , but either lost badly or cheated against them which even makes his wins irrelevant . Gomez is a loser and a cheater .

 

Per your first paragraph - none of the above is allowed, but you're taking one set of circumstances and trying to equate it to another. Gomez fought dirty at times, but like it or not, it's a part of the game. To think otherwise is foolhardy.

He didn't fight with loaded gloves or take steroids (To anyone's knowledge) so what that has to do with anything I don't know.

Must I really sit down and list all the dirty tactics of fighters who we discuss here every day? I'd be here all day and never cover even a fraction of it. Fighting dirty is not quite the same thing as fighting with loaded gloves, is it?
One is professional fouling and one is blatant cheating.

As to your third paragraph - Um, Zarate was getting the **** beat out of him in the fourth and fifth rounds. Yeah, to me Gomez was looking like a winner.
Of course Zarate could have come back, or more likely he would have been hammered even more.
We'll never know because Zarate's corner threw in the towel. They had seen enough and obviously feared for the physical well-being of their fighter, who was getting the **** kicked out of him. The final punch is incidental, because his corner were throwing in the towel.
Once again, to make it perfectly clear, Gomez was lucky to avoid the DQ, but he didn't win because of the final punch on an already downed and pretty much finished (imo) opponent.
He won because Zatare's corner had seen enough of their guy getting hammered.

atsch

Gomez lost to Sal Sanchez...a great little fighter in his own right. Is that really so terrible? He did his best and went out on his shield. I can't ask for more than that.
He lost to Nelson (Another great) when clearly past his best. (And Gomez was up on the cards. Just saying.)
He lost to Alfredo Layne who let's be honest here, wasn't that good. Gomez was at the end of the trail.

Three losses (two against greats) in an otherwise glittering career. Yeah, awful.

 

"professional fouling" - nice 1 . I C . 1 cheating is a part of d game another 1 is not . 1 is unbearable , d other is embraced .
U really do represent this forum's spirit .
Especially your post quoted here does .

As 4 Zarate , his corner saw him getting punished additionally and illegally , U don't know if they would have thrown d towel if they hadn't seen him getting hit while down . He took a few blows while up , but those he took while down were d last nail in d coffin , making it impossible and dangerous 2 even try 2 recover from , as d referee would have probably kept ignoring Gomez' fouls , not that 1 time was/is not enough . Zarate and his team's mistake was 4 agreeing 2 fight Gomez in Puerto Rico . Another place and a fair referees could have brought different outcomes .

 

Frank, I don't know what else to say. I don't think anyone embraces cheating, I certainly don't, but most are realistic enough to realise that fouling an opponent is common in this sport.
You can see rabbit punches, punches after the bell, low blows, elbows, excessive holding, 'unintentional' headbutts and who know what else, in any given fight.

Dude, it's a fight, not ballet. To expect an opponent to play nice is naive. It's up to the fighter and his corner to get on the ref's back if they feel the fighter is not being protected. That, and the fouled fighter can dish out some nasty stuff himself.

By contrast, loaded gloves as a form of cheating is way more serious. It can potentially kill or permanently maim a fighter. It's also far, far rarer an offense than low blows or punches after the bell, and something that cannot be seen in any way as part and parcel of a normal boxing match. Totally different story.

Most of this part is speculation and sounds like wishful thinking. Corners don't throw in the towel because of fouls. I think it's pretty clear why they threw in the towel - Zarate being used as a punchbag is your clue.

 

u already quoted my reply 2 this , so i don't need 2 repeat myself here at least .
So u think hitting n opponent while on his knees , n action illegal even back 2d days of d "great" Sullivan , Jeffries & Dempsey can't "potentially kill or permanently maim a fighter" ? d difference is much smaller than u (plural) think .
Regarding d other fighter needing 2 cheat back , i partially agree , with many reservations .
That means that fighter would not b able 2b considered as a clean fighter , a damage 2 his reputation , also , some fighters were raised 2 fight within d rules of d sport , very few 1's , like Pacquiao , Toney , Julian Jackson and a few others , i made a thread dedicated 2 them .
But this is d reason as 2 y i consider Holyfield's butting of Tyson legit and even respectable . But not every1 have d fouls built in their styles like Holyfield has , and Holyfield cheated not only against Tyson , but against Rahman as well , whom was a very clean fighter and did not deserve it . So should every1 try 2 cheat b4 their opponent does it 2 them ? because it should b Xpected because it's fighting ? what's d use 4 referee then ? Just have 2 "corners" and n intervention team . D referee's salary would b spared this way .

 

I think we're belabouring the point more than is neccessary about the fouling thing.
To me, it's very simple. Fouling's against the rules yeah, but it's common practice.
If a fighter is being fouled, he can either:

1) Foul back
2) Complain to the ref
3) Complain to his corner, who can complain to the ref.

Those are his options.
No fighter is going to have a silent gentleman's agreement with the other guy not to foul.

I really don't have anything more to say about fouling. Peace.

 

FACT

The 'majority' of Wilfredo Gomez' bouts were held in his 'backyard' of Puerto Rico.

Ain't no Referee going to 'DQ' him in a bout, and get out of San Juan alive.

"That's A Fact Jack"

 

Ignoring d facts :

Then stating 1 of them :

 

Regarding option #1 sometimes a fighter can not foul back and Zarate against Gomez is a very clear Xample 2 it , like Jones Griffin #2 , like Cooney Norton , Bruno vs Witherspoon and other Xamples .

Regarding d latter 2 options , Senor Pepe' answered it in his post .