Will any current champ be remembered for being the dominator in a single division???

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by flamengo, Aug 12, 2008.


  1. flamengo

    flamengo Coool as a Cucumber. Full Member

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    Throughout the last 120 years, boxing has been subjected to an ever increasing amount of changes, improvements, face slaps, degradative exploits, downturns and rebounds... There have been so many champions who inspired, created history, almost single handedly destroyed/glorified the game, changed the face of it forever, or remain totally embedded in its essence..
    With the shape and offerings of the Modern game, the numerous governing bodies, weight categories suitable to anyone, financial returns and seemingly endless ridicules due to mismatches... do we have the potential to remember the current fighters, or those of the last 20 years, in the same indomitable manner as we remember those from the introduction of "Queensberry Rules", through to the late 1960s. Doubtless, several standouts have to be accounted for, as they dominated a single division, yet, as we move on, it becomes a contest of wits amongst ourselves to determine who was a better fighter, at which weight, and for what reason, due to the manner in which the majority of champions strive to move up the divisions seeking further glory, whilst (inadvertaintly????) avoiding worthy foes.... It does make for good coversation a lot of the time... however, its fast becoming the tiresome factor when modern fighters are compared to past greats...
     
  2. Loewe

    Loewe internet hero Full Member

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    Well, right now there are only Wlad and Calderon fitting the description. Mijares has to fave Munios before he´s the man at his weight. Perhaps Ricky Hatton at jww. But can´t think of anybody else.
    The only one of them that will be remembered will be Wlad because he´s a hw.
     
  3. PowerPuncher

    PowerPuncher Loyal Member Full Member

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    Hopkins obviously will, Calazage will, Pavlik/Wlad may do although I can't see Pavlik staying at 160. Hatton got ko'd by a former Super Featherweight so he won't and hes retiring having avoided a few top contenders at 140
     
  4. Loewe

    Loewe internet hero Full Member

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    Damned, Hopkins and Calzaghe are so obvious I overlooked them.

    What about Calderon?
     
  5. punchy

    punchy Well-Known Member Full Member

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    Mayweather another if he can be counted as he has retired.
     
  6. PowerPuncher

    PowerPuncher Loyal Member Full Member

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    Calderon as good as he is hasn't done anything in terms of unification or fighting the next top men in his division/divisions and given the unfashionability of those divisions he probably won't
     
  7. Loewe

    Loewe internet hero Full Member

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    Which division has he dominated? He wasn´t long enough in any to name him here.
     
  8. PowerPuncher

    PowerPuncher Loyal Member Full Member

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    I thought Mayweather wouldnt be included because he was the multi-weight division hopper who missed some names in divisions to persue multi-division greatness. Same with Pacquaio/Barrera/Morales/Marquez

    To really be considered completely dominant in a division you need to clean it completely out and not avoid/miss any big names in that division
     
  9. PowerPuncher

    PowerPuncher Loyal Member Full Member

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    Arguably 130 -
    Hernandez (linear)
    Corales (WBA champ and P4P top5)
    Chavez (mandatory and future belt holder)
    C Hernandez (future belt holder)
    Manfredy (fresh off beating IBF champ Gatti)

    BUT at 130 he missed:

    Freitas (who probably didnt want any) and Casamayor (who was only coming to prominance as Mayweather moved to 135, little known tip bit Mayweather was looking at Casa for his opponent after Gatti when Cotto/Hatton turned him down)
    Hamed (126 champ who he called out)

    Now if you look at the rankings when Mayweather moved to 140 they are aproximately as given:

    1. Tyszu
    2. Judah
    3. Mitchell
    4. Gatti
    5. Hatton
    6. Harris
    7. Cotto
    8. Corley
    9. Witter
    10. Ndou

    Mayweather beat 5 names off that list including the future number 1 Ricky Hatton who beat the number 1 on that list and Castillo. Thats not including his win over Castillo who would be another future top3 ring magazine ranked fighter. Yet people say he did nothing at 140....

    At 135 he beat the number 1 Castillo, who would go onto dominate for the next few years after Mayweather moved up. Mayweather went on to beat Gatti who beat Dorin in 2 rounds. Dorin was the other belt holder who was robbed against fellow belt holder Spadafora. But according to most the win over Gatti was meaningless and he ducked the other 135 belt holders
     
  10. punchy

    punchy Well-Known Member Full Member

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    Undefeated great the man to beat always.
     
  11. Loewe

    Loewe internet hero Full Member

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    But he didn´t dominate a division. That´s just fact.
     
  12. Loewe

    Loewe internet hero Full Member

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    Right, he didn´t clean out the division also this is the division he came closest to but he didn´t dominate it.

    Sorry but that´s bs. He beat Hatton, Mitchell and Judah at ww not at 140. So these wins don´t count for 140. Also the man there was Tszyu and Mayweather didn´t meet him. So, yes PBF did nothing at 140. He beat Gatti who has a name but we all know where to rate Gatti, don´t we?


    Castillo wasn´t dominating. He got beat by corrales there, remember? Gatti was at 140 not at 135. The only thing of note what Mayweather did was beating (and losing to) Castillo. He didn´t dominate the division.

    Wins only count at the weightclass they happened and not where you think they fit your argument.
     
  13. PowerPuncher

    PowerPuncher Loyal Member Full Member

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    1st off with the 130 thing, he did clear out the class of 1998-2000, if you want to play he didnt face everyone, well ok - Hagler didnt clean out at middleweight (missed Herol Graham, McCallum, Kalumby)

    Does it matter if the fights took place 7lbs north of 140 if Mayweather didn't get an advantage from it being at a higher weight? Hatton was the man at 140 because he retired Tyszu, Tyszu had the choice of facing Mayweather or Hatton and choose Hatton. He still faced these fighters and won. Many historical fighters like Greb/Henry Armstrong didn't fight contenders inside the weight limit but are considered great at a said weight. Surely its about fighting the best?

    Castillo did win 3 world title bouts and avenged the Corrales defeat. Its telling that the top 2 of the next 2 years would be Mayweather 'victims'
     
  14. Sweet Pea

    Sweet Pea Obsessed with Boxing banned

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    Why Calderon? His competition has been overall pretty worthless and I strongly doubt he'd beat any elite 105-108 pounders of the past. Too one dimensional.
     
  15. Loewe

    Loewe internet hero Full Member

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    Nope. Wins at 147 aren´t playing a role when it comes to determine dominance over 140. Why would we need weightclasses then when they wouldn´t matter.