willie pastrano v nino valdes circa 1955-59'

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by choklab, Oct 21, 2011.


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  1. My2Sense

    My2Sense Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    I think it depends on which end of that time frame they fight.

    Valdes was still at or near his peak in '55 and may have been able to walk through Willie's punches and take him.

    But, Willie may have been able to outmaneuver the faded, shopworn Valdes of the later '50s.
     
    My2Sense, Oct 22, 2011
    My2Sense, Oct 22, 2011
    #16
  2. choklab

    choklab cocoon of horror Full Member

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    London was in charge of that fight with valdes before nino butted London, if london out jabs valdes in 59' so does pastrano.

    http://youtu.be/WwomhydKtc0
     
    choklab, Oct 22, 2011
    choklab, Oct 22, 2011
    #17
  3. choklab

    choklab cocoon of horror Full Member

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    But satterfeild opted to box nino. bob did not come out blazing as he did against layne and charles because (thanks to charles) by then valdes had a reputation of being game and durable. bob had a differeent style entirely to pastrano but he was boxing and he was also a LH. moore, satterfeild and harold johnson could box and like pastrano were lightheavyweights.
     
    choklab, Oct 22, 2011
    choklab, Oct 22, 2011
    #18
  4. TheGreatA

    TheGreatA Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    London of course was never careless with his head. Must've been the 6'3 Valdes's fault.

    Pastrano would beat a washed up Valdes, there was never any doubt about that.
     
    TheGreatA, Oct 22, 2011
    TheGreatA, Oct 22, 2011
    #19
  5. choklab

    choklab cocoon of horror Full Member

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    agreed.:good
     
    choklab, Oct 22, 2011
    choklab, Oct 22, 2011
    #20
  6. choklab

    choklab cocoon of horror Full Member

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    at 8.20 it is clear what valdes was doing.


    http://youtu.be/WwomhydKtc0
     
    choklab, Oct 22, 2011
    choklab, Oct 22, 2011
    #21
  7. TheGreatA

    TheGreatA Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    He was already cut by then. Seems to me that the cut may have been caused by the head clash at 6:30.
     
    TheGreatA, Oct 22, 2011
    TheGreatA, Oct 22, 2011
    #22
  8. choklab

    choklab cocoon of horror Full Member

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    yes it was around then it initialy opened but from then on valdes sole contribution was leaning his head into Londons face. Going to the body was a decoy. brian london was a "billy goat" himself but valdes was more guilty here IMO.

    great interview at the end. valdes sounds deranged.
     
    choklab, Oct 22, 2011
    choklab, Oct 22, 2011
    #23
  9. TheGreatA

    TheGreatA Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    Some quotes by Valdes:

    "It was solemn," he said,"like being with royalty."
    -About his exhibitions with Joe Louis

    "Charles was a very dangerous fighter," Nino reflected years later, "but I surprised him. I moved very agressively on him and used my weight and size and I broke his rhythm and confused him. He hit me a few good shots and I hit him back with a few good ones too. I beat him but Ezzard Charles was something special."

    "Being hit by Liston," Valdez observed, "was like being kicked by a mule. By the time I fought Liston I was over the hill. I hit him a couple of solid shots and he did not buckle. Sonny was the strongest man I ever fought and he was very tough. When I fought him I still could hit very hard but my reflexes were not there anymore."

    "He is an amateur," he answered, "and I was a pro so it is not fair to compare. Even today, old and overweight, you put me in a telephone booth with Stevenson and I'll be the one walking out of that booth on my feet."
    -About Teofilo Stevenson
     
    TheGreatA, Oct 22, 2011
    TheGreatA, Oct 22, 2011
    #24
  10. choklab

    choklab cocoon of horror Full Member

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    :good yes, thats why I was alarmed by his speach after the London fight, he is not making the sence he makes in the quotes above. maybe that interview is a translation from spanish, I read it a few years ago. its very good. there is one other interview I know of in a liston book by rob steen. nino was living in a new york room and had diabetes, I will see if I can find it.
     
    choklab, Oct 22, 2011
    choklab, Oct 22, 2011
    #25
  11. choklab

    choklab cocoon of horror Full Member

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    :good I quite agree.
     
    choklab, Jun 13, 2015
    choklab, Jun 13, 2015
    #26
  12. SuzieQ49

    SuzieQ49 The Manager Full Member

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    Pastrano would have called it a day after tasting the much bigger mans power and strength
     
    SuzieQ49, Jun 14, 2015
    SuzieQ49, Jun 14, 2015
    #27
  13. SuzieQ49

    SuzieQ49 The Manager Full Member

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    You mean the one who beat Brian London, who, knocked out pastrano?
     
    SuzieQ49, Jun 14, 2015
    SuzieQ49, Jun 14, 2015
    #28
  14. choklab

    choklab cocoon of horror Full Member

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    London was kicking valdes ass. The ref stopped London on a cut. Nino had been butting him all night.

    Brian stopped pastrano on cuts too. Nobody was knocked out in either fight.
     
    choklab, Jun 14, 2015
    choklab, Jun 14, 2015
    #29
  15. choklab

    choklab cocoon of horror Full Member

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    I'm not so sure.

    Alonzo Johnson, Archie Moore and Harold Johnson all beat Nino quite soundly yet neither of them could beat Willie. It's not like Pastrano could not handle big ponderous heavyweights because he beat John Holman and D1ck Richardson. He has the pedigree.

    You could say Pastrano represented everything Valdes struggled to beat speedy clever boxers.
     
    choklab, Jun 14, 2015
    choklab, Jun 14, 2015
    #30
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