willie pastrano v nino valdes circa 1955-59'

Unofficial AP scorecard (after 7 completed rounds) - 3-3-1 even.

No he didn't, London Quit

"Cuban Nino Valdes but won the companion 10 rounder on the all-heavyweight card when Briton Brian London called it quits after seven rounds. The crowd of 11,000 wasn't happy with the bout, booing, clapping and stamping their feet as London announced he was quitting because of cuts. ." -Associated Press

 

And Joe Erskine beat Pastrano, but got knocked out in 1 round by Valdes. How do you explain this?

"Nino Valdes, the big Cuban who is making a habit of whipping British heavyweights, scored a TKO over Joe Erskine, Britain's champion, last night at 2:03 of the 1st round of a scheduled 10 rounder. Valdes finished Erskine almost before the capacity crowd of 18,000 had settled in it's seats at Earls Court Arena. A right to the chin sent Erskine down for a six count. As he got off the canvas, Valdes followed with a solid left hook. Erskine, who never had been beaten in 30 professional fights, was so groggy he did not know what was happening. He was defenseless and went down again when Valdes landed several more good punches. Referee Jack Hart then stopped the fight." -United Press


Pastrano fought a 45 year old fat Archie Moore, and still couldn't beat him. That's Embarrassing. Valdes fought a much better version of Archie Moore to the brink of defeat over 15 gruelling rounds

Again, Pastrano fought a 34 year old Harold Johnson. Nino Valdes fought a prime Harold Johnson.

Pastrano also LOST to Alonzo Johnson



"Willie Pastrano, his right hand dunked in a bucket of ice water, wants another crack at Alonzo Johnson. Johnson, a former Braddock, Pa., barber, unleashed a punishing body attack Friday night to earn a unanimous 10 round decision over the nimble Pastrano. Pastrano said he jammed his right thumb in the 1st round but it did not hamper him from using his right hand. He said he felt a little rusty after a layoff since February. Johnson and manager Mike Bazzone said they followed a pre-fight plan calculated to slow down the fleet Willie. A punishing body attack in the 7th round staggered Pastrano, but he did not go down." -Associated Press

Valdes wasn't big and ponderous. He was big, powerful, strong, and had a good left jab.

You mention John Holman and **** Richardson. Valdes easily beat both of those two men, Richardson by easy knockout.


"Nino Valdes of Cuba, who'll be 32 years old tomorrow, scored a TKO over Britain's heavyweight hopeful **** Richardson in the 8th round of their scheduled 10 round fight tonight. A sellout crowd of 11,000 saw the crafty Cuban club 22 year old Richardson into bloody defeat. Valdes scored the only knockdown of the fight when he sent Richardson to the canvas for a count of eight in the 2nd round with a smashing left hook." -Associated Press

Except Valdes beat Ezzard Charles, who was leagues above Pastrano as a fighter.

What 6'3 215lb world class heavyweight did Pastrano beat with the power, strength, and left jab of Valdes?

 

Chokelab resents anyone who Sonny Liston defeated. Primarily big black athletic powerful heavyweights. He tries to talk up short, overprotected, unathletic white fighters like Johansson, Pastrano, Harris, Erskine, Miteff, Lastarza.

 

Nino beat a much better version of Charles. Charles speed reflexes were much faster in 53 compared to 55. Check the films. Nino beat Charles BEFORE Marciano did. Holman beat Charles in 1955 after Charles had suffered two beatings from Marciano

Valdes beat the same Charles that Marciano did.

 

Stop making excuses for Charles!!!!! He lost to Valdes because Valdes fought better than he did. No excuses!!! Valdes kicked his buttt

 

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=xucbDkwcH5A
Valdes looks good here demolishing a very durable top 5 contender in 2 rounds whom went 22 rounds with Floyd Patterson

 

Pastrano was unathletic???

I just watchd the Harold Johnson fight, and, frankly, I can't really relate to anyone who thinks Pastrano wasn't athletic.

He looked very quick, and moved faster, longer than almost anyone I can remember watching at the higher weights.

I was really surprised watching the tape that he made Johnson miss so much.

Sure, Johnson was 35, but it wasn't like he was losing to anyone else.

 

As I said earlier, Valdez was a bit big and rangy for Pastrano (who wasn't at all unathletic, see Pastrano-Johnson for that), but consider that Willie had a better chin than London, and when in shape was the "wil-o-the-wisp" with million dollar legs and jab, and could very well have outboxed Valdez like he did other bigger men.

 

Excellent post em:thumbsup....only read it after I posted, but thanks for mentioning Pastrano-Johnson...only Ali rivaled WP as a mover....and Willie moved like that for 15 rounds...yeah, he would have outboxed Valdez.

 

You went as far to say you think a Johansson-Liston fight is a 50-50 fight

That's ludicrous

 

Ahhh the harold Johnson-pastrano fight. That fight may have been in the bag for pastrano before the fight even started, all he had to do was survive the 15 and he'd get the decision. That said I thought johnson beat him.

Pastrano is being overrated here. He lost to average European heavyweights whom Valdes stopped inside the distance, he lost in his prime mutiple times to average light heavyweights, and lost his title by getting dominated by Torres.

 

Outboxed Valdes? You mean the way he was outboxed by average European joe Erskine? The same man Valdes destroyed in 1. The way he was stopped inside the distance by Brian friggin London? Or got outboxed by the unimpressive Roy Harris ?


Nino Valdes soundly beat ezzard Charles in 53 and nearly beat archie Moore in 55. Both versions of charles and moore would have mopped the floor with pastrano. Valdes was so dangerous that Marciano didn't rush to fight him and Patterson wanted no part of him. He also beat ring magazine top 10 fighters hurricane Jackson Johnny summerlin highly touted Harold carter mike de john don cokkell Heinz Neuhaus ...i think Valdes heavyweight resume easily trumps pastranos.

Valdes was 6 foot 3 215lb, he had big power, a lot of strength, good jab and he was durable and rangy. Pastrano never came close to beating this type of fighter before. Valdes would jab pastrano a eye shut them walk down pastrano and maul him to death with his strength and power. He could easily take whatever willie had to offer.

willie may have moved well but he wasn't that good. He lost to small average fighters Thornton calderwood and Bowery. Valdes knocks all of those men out