willie pastrano v nino valdes circa 1955-59'

"overprotected"

Pastrano fought Del Flanagan, who was rated #4 at welter in that years Ring ratings in 1953 when he was 17. He defeated Bobby D-ykes, who had fought Sugar Ray Robinson and Kid Gavilan on pretty much even terms, when he was 18. At 19 he defeated Joey Maxim and Rex Layne.

Coming as close as I can, Pastrano seems to have fought at least 38 fights against men who were rated in the yearly or monthly ratings. He won 23, lost 10, and drew 5.

Pastrano was not protected generally, fighting a lot of top men, and often in the other fellows home town, but he spent most of his career fighting below the heavyweight division,

"ordinary fighters" "Calderwood, Thornton, Bowdry."

Thornton was once the #1 light-heavyweight contender. Calderwood #2. Bowdry was the guy Harold Johnson defeated to win recognition from the NBA as world champion.

If these are "ordinary" fighters, then all of Valdes' victims save Charles might be designated ordinary.

 

Edward


We are Talking about willie Pastrano beating a 6 foot three 215 pound top ranking contender with a huge punch and a lot of strength who happened to easily beat a Hall of Fame heavyweight who is far better than Pastrano

He also Almost beat Archie Moore in the rematch. A 1955 Moore would have knocked out Pastrano


Sorry I can't see a 5 foot 9 feather fisted light heavyweight who lost to poor European heavyweights beating a 6 foot 3 215 pound monster like Valdes. Valdes walks him down and destroys him

Pastrano never came close to fighting anyone as big and powerful as Valdes. Valdes beat better heavyweights than Pastrano

If Valdes could beat Ezzard he would kill Pastrano

 

Edward I just posted concrete evidence that shows it is asinine that willie got rated in the top 5 at heavyweight 4 years in a row. One win over a washed up Rex Layne in 1955 somehow got him that ranking. His resume at heavyweight is extremely unimpressive and his management avoided heavyweights with size and punching power


Why are you defending Pastrano here? You actually think that feather fisted midget had a chance against a big powerful top ranking heavyweight who beat Ezzard Charles and nearly beat a prime Archie Moore?

 

Edward you listing a bunch of stiffs who weighed above 200lb whom Pastrano beat doesn't mean he could defeat a number 1 rated 6 foot 3 215lb heavyweight with a lot of punching power whom defeated Ezzard Charles


Tell me what 6 foot 3 215lb heavyweight did Pastrano ever fight with the punching power left jab and credentials of Nino Valdes????

You bring up Valdes losses to Johnson and miteff which happened well past his prime ...not to mention Pastrano lost to Alonzo Johnson


You neglect pastranos loss to joe erskine whom Valdes destroyed in 1 round

You neglect pastranos losses to Brian London and Roy Harris, neither of whom come even close to Valdes punching power size or ability

Compare the two best heavyweight performances Valdes produced compared to the two best heavyweight performances Pastrano produced? Who comes out on top?


Name me a top 5 rated ring magazine fighter whom Pastrano fought that was over 6 foot 3 210lb? Top 5 at the time Pastrano fought him

 

Edward

You bring up Archie Moore. Pastrano could not even beat a 45 year old fat Archie Moore in 1962 , how embarrassing .. Can you imagine what a prime Valdes would have done to a 45 year old Archie Moore??

Valdes nearly beat a near prime version of Archie Moore in 1955. The fight was dead even going into the last round. How do you think Pastrano does against this version of Moore?

How do you think Pastrano does against a 1953 Ezzard Charles? He gets killed


You think a prime Nino Valdes would ever lose to men like Johnson erskine London Harris? He mops the floor with all of them

How about Bowdry and calderwood? Think those men could compete with a prime Nino Valdes?

 

What was his ranking at the time he fought Pastrano? He was unrated

 

No it's not it's a very bias breakdown.

He gave Pastrano credit for beating Harold Johnson when he failed to mention Johnson was 35 years old past his prime and it was a controversial decision

Then he tried to give Pastrano credit for fighting to a draw with a fat 45 year old Archie Moore

Valdes beat Ezzard Charles a far better fighter than Pastrano and he nearly beat a prime Archie Moore....

 

I'm laughing right now. The thought of a midget feather fisted overprotected light heavyweight beating a huge punching 6 foot 3 215lb heavyweight who beat Ezzard Charles


Pastrano in his prime lost to Roy Harris chic calderwood Jessie Bowdry Brian London and joe erskine that's garbageeeeee

Valdes never lost to that kind of mediocrity In his prime and beat heavyweights far better than Pastrano.

Pastrano could never handle Valdes size punching power strength and left jab

 

I guess Pastrano could beat a 1953 Ezzard Charles and win 7 rounds out of 15 against a 1955 Archie Moore right?

Pastrano in his prime lost to joe friggin erskine!!!! Hahahahaha

 

"He gave Pastrano credit for beating Harold Johnson"

Because he did.

"controversial decision"

Not to me. I just watched it and scored it 8-6-1 for Pastrano.

"35 years old"

I mentioned it was fair to point out that Johnson was much older than he had been when he fought Valdes.

"past his prime"

That old cliché again. Watch the Jones fight from 1962. I think it was one of Johnson's best performances. Hard to say if he had gone back much. What we know is Johnson hadn't lost since 1955.

"credit for fighting a draw with Archie Moore"

Other than Ali, Moore was handling the other guys he was fighting, but your age point is well taken.

"Valdes beat Ezzard Charles a far better fighter than Pastrano"

And lost to Alex Miteff and I judge Ezzard Charles a far better fighter than Miteff.

*One point, when is this fight supposed to take place? I assume it would be sometime between 1957 and 1959.

 

Why do you consider Alex Miteff all that much better than Harris?

"Valdes size punching power"

Holman was not that much smaller than Valdes and arguably was the bigger puncher.

At least I would be more impressed with Holman's list of knockout victims.

 

"If Valdes could beat Ezzard he would kill Pastrano"

Another killer in fantasy matches.

Too bad he couldn't beat Alex Miteff in their real fight.

I remember seeing Miteff getting beat twice by Billy Hunter in 1959. Brian London later KO'd Hunter. It is on youtube.

Valdes did beat better heavyweights than Pastrano, but his whole career was at heavyweight, while Pastrano really fought mainly at light-heavy.

I think taking into consideration fighters from all divisions, Pastrano fought and defeated more good fighters than Valdes.