Wills v liston, foreman ,tyson,lewis

never saw the guy fight. although i imagine liston could have beaten just about any fighter i've heard of / can fathom except louis & ali. foreman & tyson are vulnerable to getting outboxed. although to outbox foreman you needed a lot of speed. foreman could get staggered / off balance with really fast shots. i hear willis wasn't too fast so scratch off foreman.

lewis - if this willis chap wasn't known as a big puncher (as in doesn't hit harder than someone like holyfield (who was reasonably heavy handed)) then i'd put blind money on lewis.

 

whats with the constant posts about Wills just now

i dont think he would beat any IMO but i havent seen alot of him

 

for very good reasons. that is warranted.

 

lose, lose, lose, lose

 

He could beat the 70's Foreman, kind of a 50/50 fight for me, I think he'd lose to Liston and Lewis who are both in my heavyweight H2H Top 5. But they'd both be close decision losses.

 

fair enough

i think he would be a bit to small for these guys and not as powerful

 

He ko's tyson

 

Now that I think of it, he might match up fairly well with Tyson. From what I've read Wills liked to clinch and smother his opponent, and was quite adept at it, something you need to be able to do to beat Tyson. Tyson wasn't very good in the clinches. Wills had a good chin and excellent boxing ability as well. I think he'd have a good chance to frustrate and tire Tyson out and take over late. If he survived to see the final bell, I might give him a better than even chance to win on the cards.

 

Good call in picking Willis-Tyson because that fight would have the greatest similarity to the much speculated Willis-Dempsey, for the better or the worse.

 

The primary differences are that Dempsey was mentally stronger than Tyson and Dempsey was excellent in the clinches.

 

I really don't think anyone can draw an accurate conclusion as to how Harry Wills would have fared against any fighter, given that there is no film available ( or at least none that I have heard of ), and that anyone who ever saw him fight in person has likely been dead for decades now. The only thing that is left, are testimonies written in the pages of history, all of which authored by writers, many of whom probably never lived to see a champion post Marciano.

What we do know is that Harry Wills for the most part, had to fight the best of his day, and often emerged victorious. Among his list of scalps were Gunboat Smith, Luis Angel Firpo, Sam Langford ( multiple times ), Joe Jeanette, Floyd Johnson, Fred Fulton, Ed Martin, Sam Mcvey, etc, etc..... He was 6'2", and over 200 Lbs - A large man by the standards of the day. His career stretched over 20 years, and over 100 pro fights, consisting of over 80 victories... We know that he was a man who some felt could have beaten Dempsey and at times, even exceeds him in all time ratings ( depending on who's list you're looking at. )

Conclusion: I don't know if he'd beat Mike Tyson, Sonny Liston, or anyone else. I suppose considering that any fantasy matchup is based on educated guessing with or without footage, that Wills could in theory be given just as good of a chance as even a fighter who's entire career was viewable on screen.... Would I be one to pick him with any real conviction? Probably not. Wills' career, along with Sam Langford and many others, is sadly left to speculation. We can credit them for the appraisal that they were given by historians and those who were good enough to leave their legacies behind on paper. But, I'm afraid the benefit of the doubt must be limited.

 

There is no doubt that Wills was a very good fighter. But, the fact that he was knocked out by Sam Langford and also much later on by Uzcuden must be a big concern considering the four fighters that he has been matched with here. I think that he loses to all 4 fighters and i also think he loses to Dempsey. But make no mistake, if he fought all four of them as often as he fought Langford he would not lose every single fight to them. He wasnt as good as any of them, but he was definetly in their class. He definitely beats the past prime versions of these guys that fought, probably by the same brutal knockouts that these versions suffered in reality. In relation to Louis, if he catches him with a McCall or Rahman style knockout punch, the result would be the same also.

 

1. Foreman---Foreman had stamina and defense problems. We don't have film of Wills, but we can tell from the record that he could go a ways. If I have to pick blind, I would pick Wills. Foreman probably has to knock Wills out early to win and that might be questionable more often than not.

2. Tyson---Tyson generally did not do that well with tall men. Wills is listed by boxrec as 6' 2" but the old Ring Record Books, compiled by men who knew Wills personally, listed him as 6' 4" and off what he looks like in photos and on film, I think that height is probably accurate. As has been pointed out by others, Wills was known as a good infighter who could frustrate a man with clinches and work him over to the body. Again, I think Tyson has to score an early knockout to win a fight scheduled for 15 or 20. If I have to pick blind, I think Wills is a slight favorite.

3. Liston---I have no idea how that big jab works against Wills. Certainly Wills is big enough and probably strong enough to hold his own. If I have to pick blind, I pick Liston, but with no assurance. Wills probably has the stamina edge, which could prove crucial.

4. Lewis---I think Lewis wins more often than not. He is the one man here who is both taller than Wills and probably more skilled. I wouldn't bet the family farm on him, though, because of his whiskers.

I would rate Wills as a better bet than Dempsey against all these men.