Without Don Kings influence, would Tyson have been greater?

He didn't "poison" Tyson. (LOL)

Most boxers switch trainers and managers. Few ever go their entire careers with the same trainers and managers. Tyson Fury has had a half-dozen trainers and multiple promoters. Was he 'poisoned' against all of them? Oscar De La Hoya seemed to hire a new trainer after every fight at some point.

This Mike Tyson garbage is hysterical. He was never supposed to switch trainers. He was never supposed to switch managers. His wife was never supposed to spend his money. And he never should've had King as his promoter when Don King was the biggest promoter on earth.

 

What bias? How on earth would Mike Tyson have been GREATER without working with the most powerful promoter of the day? How would Mike Tyson have been greater if he didn't fight in the HBO Tournament King promoted? How would Mike Tyson be greater if he wasn't the youngest champ in boxing history and he had to wait additional years for a title shot? How would Mike Tyson have been greater if he'd been forced to work with a trainer he no longer wanted to work with (because Tyson dumped Rooney for what Rooney said about his wife, not anything Rooney said about King)?

Tell me how Tyson would've been greater avoiding Don King and not letting King promote any of his fights? Who would Tyson have fought?

Would Tyson have been greater if he went the WBO route and never unified?

Would Tyson have been greater if he toiled for six years without a belt and then had to fight Lennox Lewis in 1992 for a shot at the Bowe-Holyfield winner?

Does Tyson beat Bowe, Lewis or Holyfield in 1992?

Who does Tyson ever beat to become champ that makes him GREATER than he actually was?

 

Really the thing that triggered his decline was Jacobs dying shortly after Cus. That was game over as far as Mike Tyson having a healthy outlook/life at that time. The thing is Mike was a kid. He was just a kid. Jacobs was his last real link to what he trusted with that Cus drilled into him.
He was ill equiped to make good decisions with sharks in the water everywhere.
My point is if it wasnt Don King manipulating it could have been someone else. Tyson was a Chameleon. He mimicked and played the role whoever was in control of his buisness. He was a kid and kid who had less experiance handling anything other than boxing. He was like 20 going on 12 emotionally. Im not knocking Mike.
I was gonna start a thread couple of months ago polling all of us about we think we could have handled Mike Tyson's pressure and intrigue. How many of us would have came through that maze without suffering similarly to Tyson. In the ring and out. I couldnt have dealt with it any better, probably a bit worse.
Just as a boxer he was great when he loved it. He loved it because Cus was his dad that he was making dad proud. Once that was stripped away he didnt want to box anymore. He was done mentally before Spinks IMO.
Tyson is complex. So many different characters to point to but Tyson was self destructing and Rooney is probably the most insignificant part of it. Not to mention the style that Mike had to use took so much energy, commitment, desire, timing. When he loved his job it was a work of art.

 

Well he woule have fought who is manager thought was the next guy to fight. When King became his manager that was the end of Mike being managed. His best interests were not being protected.

 

You said Don King 'poisoned' Tyson's mind. How is that an unbiased take?

How did he poison his mind? Seriously.

Mike Tyson dumped Rooney for what Rooney said about his wife. Tyson didn't want to work with Rooney any more after that. How is Rooney badmouthing Tyson's wife Don King's fault?

 

If he wasn't promoted by King, he never would've fought Douglas, because Tyson wouldn't have had the unified titles to begin with because he never would've been included in the HBO tournament ... and winning all three titles is erased, too.

Right?

So not only is the loss to Douglas erased, but Tyson never fights for any of those three belts, because King controlled all of them and the tournament.

If he avoids King, he has to look for titles somewhere else. And the WBO belt was created in 1989. If he avoids King, that's the route he has to take.

So maybe Cayton uses his South Africa ties to get Tyson a WBO title fight in 1989 (three years after he actually fought for a title).

Without King, Tyson almost finds himself taking the Ray Mercer/Michael Moorer heavyweight route to a WBO shot.

Is that the path to greater heavyweight acclaim?

 

I'm not bashing Tyson. He's an all-time great. He had an all-time great career.

My take is he would not have been even greater without King.

He needed King to reach greatness because King was the biggest promoter in the sport. Without King, coming up in the second half of the 80s, Tyson wouldn't have gotten nearly as far as fast.

If someone thinks he'd have gotten further without King, lay it out.

What's the path to greatness from 1985 on if Tyson didn't have Don King as his promoter, knowing the TV deals King had at the time, and all the champs and contenders he controlled at the time?

 

Its one thing to say Tyson changed managers. He was being fed the idea that Bill Cayton was Satan and up to no good. + he was white. King was working that and Robin Givens was hitting those same notes from the inside. Mike threw away his only agent that mignt have been interested his best interests. If he had been able to trust Bill Cayton maybe things go a little better. He could have pulled away from King got rid of that noise

 

He would have fought for them because King would have given in and kissed assed to get close to Mike. What do you think Don was going to do for 4 years? Be content with Tubbs and Page laying on each other?
Promoting his fights and Managing Tyson's career are different things. That is the obvious part.
The public would have demanded he fight for the title. Nobody cared about WBA, WBC, IBF. They could have invented a belt to fight for. The fighter makes the belt in reality. In Tyson's case his appeal was a force of nature.