Without PED would Evander Holyfield have been as successul in the heavyweight division as was?

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by mark ant, Jan 28, 2019.



  1. mark ant

    mark ant Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Without the bulk that 'Vander put on using PED`s could have beat the big names that he went on to beat and if you disagree that he was on PED`s then could he have been successful being the same size as he was in the first Bowe fight anyhow?
     
  2. Entaowed

    Entaowed Well-Known Member Full Member

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    Of course he was on PEDs. The evidence is very convincing.

    Of course he would not have been as successful. He was unlikely to ever beat Bowe or Tyson ~ 205, let alone some others.
    Whatever small loss he likely had in speed & work rate was more than made up for in strength & likely punch resistance.
     
  3. JackSilver

    JackSilver Active Member Full Member

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    As light as he was Holyfield would still have beaten any other heavyweight at that time.He was just unlucky that he fought a Bowe that fought the finest fight and in the best shape of his career on that night.
     
  4. sauhund II

    sauhund II Well-Known Member Full Member

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    A Holyfield without PED's would have done still pretty well but he would have deteriorated rather quickly due to his brawling style and taking tons of punishment.

    Most people underestimate that PED's "rebuild" the body, fast metabolism, fast recovery, literally no soreness , training beyond the threshold etc etc...........btw, Holyfield was obsessed with weights and cardio machines and had to be pushed to spar.

    His heart condition most likely was a enlarged heart due to steroid use.
     
  5. InMemoryofJakeLamotta

    InMemoryofJakeLamotta Boxing Addict Full Member

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    If you mean Holyfield weighing 187-190 pounds, he likely could have taken some of the modern sized heavies he'd fought. I think that Ray Mercer may have possible been the best he could have taken at that weight. Maybe he could have taken old Foreman and old Holmes. Maybe. Old Holmes gave him fits while he weighed 210 pounds, he wouldn't have done himself any favors being 20 pounds lighter, maybe with the exception of his work rate. Old Foreman did nail him with some solid shots and if he was 20 or so pounds lighter, who knows how well he'd have taken those shots.

    But Tyson, Bowe and Lewis...no. And like someone said, the punishment would have worn on him quicker and I don't think that his chin would have been as good. At 187-190 pounds, he may have been stopped by all 3.
     
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  6. KuRuPT

    KuRuPT Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    He still would've won most of the fights he did anyways.
     
  7. BitPlayerVesti

    BitPlayerVesti Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Not a chance. Not without success, but not as much.
     
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  8. Wass1985

    Wass1985 Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    About as good as the other HW's if they didn't jab needles in their ass.
     
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  9. mark ant

    mark ant Boxing Addict Full Member

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    He was too small in his first fight v Bowe.
     
  10. mark ant

    mark ant Boxing Addict Full Member

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    But most heavies are naturally bigger than Holy was.
     
  11. PhillyPhan69

    PhillyPhan69 Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    For me it depends on whether the majority of the era was using them as well, and are they allowed to keep doping but he is not, If none of them are allowed to I think it might unfold in a similar fashion with many of them including him losing some of their longevity. The recovery aspect and rapid healing etc. would hurt many of them. I guess it depends on how wide you think they were used. I tend to lean towards most of the generation being corrupted by it ala MLB
     
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  12. janitor

    janitor Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    I have often wondered if he might have done better to come in a bit lighter, to maximize his speed and work rate.
     
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  13. mark ant

    mark ant Boxing Addict Full Member

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    He was far better in his rematch with Bowe and his footwork was more nimble and active.
     
  14. Jackomano

    Jackomano Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Holyfield would've likely had more success without the steroids and had a longer prime, since all adding the muscle on did was make him slower and easier to time and his handspeed and workrate suffered. At 190-200 Holyfield's superior mobility, speed, workrate, and stamina would've allowed him to wear down the big guys. If anything Holyfield is lucky all of the substances he was stacking didn't kill him, since a lot of NBA players from the 90's, who were also trained by by both Lee Haney and Frederick Hatfield and were put on similar stacks of Equipoise and Test are dying off in their late 40's to early 50's.

    Lee Haney talking about working with Holyfield.
     
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  15. steve21

    steve21 Member Full Member

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    I can't recall where, but I read Hatfield alluded that Evander wasn't as dedicated in training as you might imagine, and sometimes preferred the party life to the gym life ...
     
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